The Songwriting of Live Options

[themaestro]

If you want to go by album notes:

The first 3 albums are credited as this:

All lyrics written by Ed Kowalczyk, all music composed by Live. Which means all four supposedly worked on the music, while Ed wrote the lyrics. If that was the case, Ed should receive a larger royalty than CCP, since he wrote the lyrics solo, and contributed to the music as well.

On The Distance to Here:
All songs written by Ed Kowalczyk, except:
"Run to the Water" (Kowalczyk, Patrick Dahlheimer)
"Voodoo Lady" (Kowalczyk, Chad Taylor)
"They Stood Up for Love" (Kowalczyk, Dahlheimer, Taylor)
10 songs were credited to Ed solo yet he still shared 75 percent of royalties with CCP including major hit The Dolphin's Cry.

V:
All songs written by Ed, royalties shared by full band.

BOP:
All songs written by Ed Kowalczyk, except:
"Like I Do" (Kowalczyk, Patrick Dahlheimer, Chad Taylor)
"Lighthouse" (Kowalczyk, Taylor) – 3:08
9 songs written by Ed solo including the hit Heaven, where he only received 25 percent royalties.

SFBM
All Ed, and yet CCP are suing over song-writing royalties for songs they didn't write and have denounced.

First off, you need to go back and re-aquaint yourself with funky's post on the songwriting credits and royalties. You have it all wrong. They share credits on nearly everything. Secondly, did you read the rest of my post? What about all the other stuff that went into making Live who they were and the music what it was. Doesn't matter to you apparently. Do you think these songs had any input or influence from anyone else at all? Perhaps as these songs took shape, as Ed worked his ideas out, as they worked them out in practice, demos, recording, etc. Nah, probably not. Ed was the sole creative well for everything. Right.

[World Dreamer]

First off, you need to go back and re-aquaint yourself with funky's post on the songwriting credits and royalties. You have it all wrong. They share credits on nearly everything. Secondly, did you read the rest of my post? What about all the other stuff that went into making Live who they were and the music what it was. Doesn't matter to you apparently. Do you think these songs had any input or influence from anyone else at all? Perhaps as these songs took shape, as Ed worked his ideas out, as they worked them out in practice, demos, recording, etc. Nah, probably not. Ed was the sole creative well for everything. Right.

Nick can only see Ed.

[Pokey]

The fact is, we weren't watching them write these songs. We really don't know who did what and to what extent it contributed. CAG may have played a MAJOR part in helping a song come together that he didn't write. Nick just does not understand this.
I was in a band previously a few years back, when we sat around jamming and trying to write a song, sometimes the drummer who was barely every there because he was a lazy (but talented) SOB would turn up and we'd be stuck on a bit and he'd mention something, or play something and that was the missing piece, that helped everything fall into place together. He didn't write the song, but his one bit of input was the missing link, without that the song wouldn't have been the same. How do we know for sure that Ed and CT weren't stuck on a bit on a song, CAG walks into the room and goes "hey guys, how about..." and bang, that's the idea they needed and off the go and suddenly STD is born! (as a hypothetical example). The truth is, we just don't know, and the "worth" of someone as measurable by how much money they get is just ... just, who the fuck cares?? A good TRUE band of good friends will generally split that shit evenly, happily get paid and get on doing what they love. Unless you're a greedy fuckwit like Ed K.

Nick just can not comprehend this because he can not see the worth in CCP, it is what we have said all along, he is only a fan of Ed, he can not even give a MUSICAL reason as to why he wants Ed back with CCP.

Ed talks now about how dynamic Ramy is in the writing process (lololol) but yet, Ed gets all the writing credits ... how can Ramy be dynamic when writing and contribute?? Surely if Ed is getting all the writing credits then Ramy didn't do a damn thing?!

This just boils down to the fact Nick has absolutely no idea when it comes to music, making music, writing music, recording music etc... it would be like me trying to join in a conversation about cars. I have no idea. And surprise, surprise, the angle Nick wants to keep arguing over is the royalties and money side of things. This guy is just a god damn joke.

This post has been edited by Pokey: Nov 28 2012, 11:13 am

[PurdueSteve]

Onto the secret contract, do you guys feel that CCP were responsible for writing 30 percent of SFBM?

Yes, and they should be ashamed.

When you listen to any of those songs, I hear CAGs drums, PDs bass and CTs individual parts that Ed didn't write. By this time all they did is come in an plop down their parts and let Ed do ALL of the arrangement. Which is a point I keep referring to and that you keep ignoring. The process was disjointed. Meaning they didn't participate in the decisions of "do we go to a pre-chorus here or do we go to a bridge here, ect". Instead Ed wrote on his acoustic guitar, wrote the lyrics and arranged the songs. Afterwards they came in and wrote their respective parts. Most of the credit goes to Ed but Ed DID NOT write the parts for all instruments, hence some credit going to those guys.

In the earlier days the guys participated MORE than just their respective instruments.

How can you not see this?

[+Ed+]

What question?

Wow.
I will not rephrase it for the third time, I will simply quote myself for you not to scroll the thread.

SO what you are saying is that he wrote all the guitar, bass and drum parts for all the songs?

Could you answer my question please?

Does this mean that all the songs, meaning, all the guitar parts, bass parts and drum parts were written by Ed Kowalczyk?

Saying this, do you think that Patrick did not write bass parts to Sofia and Good Pain, PLOTR and OK?

If you say he only "performs using his talent". Ok, I can agree that he is very talented. But who WROTE his bass parts?

I can simply do with "Yes" or "No". You do not have to explain your point to me. I just asked you for an answer.

No fan of music should really care about royalty percentages, much less to the levels of obsession that Nick does. As I said, mental issues.

Of course not, kid, but really, we all would love our faves to make up for a living of not to say get the money, right?

I have a tiny example of how the money does not matter. One of my faves, SOiL performed in Moscow several days ago. They were once pretty popular with several hits. Then they had another vocalist and now the original vocaist is back (no pun, just FYI). They do not have any money to record a new LP.
They came to Russia for the first time to perform in a club hosting 2000 people. They were smashed when they found out only 200-300 tickets were sold. They hit the stage and those couple hundreds met them SO madly, the band was in shock. Those couple hundreds roared each song by heart, had several moshpits, jumped on the stage, hugged the band, stagedived... The band was SO impressed, Ryan (the vocalist) nearly cried and said he was not understood at home as he is here, in Russia.

See!

Those 200 people did not cover the expenses for their travel I think. But the band is still buzzing after the gig, so impressed they are!

[PurdueSteve]

I'm still wondering if it's "fair" the Ed collects royalties on "Drink" when Chris Daughtry wrote part of it?

[World Dreamer]

How can you not see this?

Oh! Oh! I know!

Nick can only see Ed.

[+Ed+]

Oh! Oh! I know!

Nick can only see Ed.

Damn , mate, you are seriously on fire today

[World Dreamer]

If Ed suddenly became the lead singer of U2 Nick would somehow justify and spin that Ed should get all royalties for all past albums and songs.

I can see it now..."Since Ed REPLACED the guy that wrote the songs he should get 100% of the royalties."

[Pokey]

Surprise surprise, the heat gets turned up again, people push for more info, backed up claims, evidence, specific answers ... and the cowardly lion runs away again.

[themaestro]

Surprise surprise, the heat gets turned up again, people push for more info, backed up claims, evidence, specific answers ... and the cowardly lion runs away again.

To him, ignorance is bliss. In reality, it's just ignorance.

[World Dreamer]

This game is getting old.

Nick makes unfounded statements.

Nick is ask to prove his statements.

Nick leaves.

Nick returns with new unfounded statements or rehashes old ones he never backed up.

[Sonic Tonic]

You guys have totally lost it, the whole lot of ya.

[themaestro]

You guys have totally lost it, the whole lot of ya.

Yeah, I know. Doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result is the definition of insanity. I guess that's what some passionate people will do though in the face of such BS. Some people are very close to the band for various reasons. I get it.

[World Dreamer]

You guys have totally lost it, the whole lot of ya.

YOU WANT THE TRUTH?!?!? YOU CAN'T HANDLE THE TRUTH!!!!!