Ed is a Hypocrite., People Like You Options

[SinfulEyes]

I was giving V a spin last night and it really struck me how bad Ed is a sell-out and a hypocrite.

His new music SCREAMS from the top of the lungs of mainstream and pop yet in People Like You, he claims he is "pissing in the mainstream (of music)"

And people around here wonder why most Live fans "diehards" have jumped the Ed ship. I've gotta say that the ones who still support him and consume his music and coffee paraphernalia are definitely hypocrites themselves.

How do you feel about this?

[FishOutaWater]

I was giving V a spin last night and it really struck me how bad Ed is a sell-out and a hypocrite.

His new music SCREAMS from the top of the lungs of mainstream and pop yet in People Like You, he claims he is "pissing in the mainstream (of music)"

And people around here wonder why most Live fans "diehards" have jumped the Ed ship. I've gotta say that the ones who still support him and consume his music and coffee paraphernalia are definitely hypocrites themselves.

How do you feel about this?

He was selling out on V too. At the time, the popular rock acts were doing a rock/rap thing, like Kid Rock and Linkin Park, etc., and Ed tried to tap into that for popularity. Then with BoP he tried unsuccessfully to replicate Throwing Copper. Then with SFBM he tried to go adult contemporary and sexy middle-aged guy for soccer moms. Now he is trying to go Christian Rock and Daughtry. Anything to play to whatever the latest thing is that gets on radio.

This post has been edited by FishOutaWater: Sep 9 2010, 12:11 pm

[+Ed+]

Well, Cornell already rnb-ed.

So there is hardly anything left for Ed

[SinfulEyes]

He was selling out on V too. At the time, the popular rock acts were doing a rock/rap thing, like Kid Rock and Linkin Park, etc., and Ed tried to tap into that for popularity. Then with BoP he tried unsuccessfully to replicate Throwing Copper. Then with SFBM he tried to go adult contemporary and sexy middle-aged guy for soccer moms. Now he is trying to go Christian Rock and Daughtry. Anything to play to whatever the latest thing is that gets on radio.

You are 100% correct. Seriously, this FishOutaWater guy is the voice of reason. I bow to you.

Ed is a TOTAL sell out. Why does he even still have fans? I am guessing it's from the shirtless stage dancing... (looks at Nick)

[livefan1999]

I've gotta say that the ones who still support him and consume his music and coffee paraphernalia are definitely hypocrites themselves.

How do you feel about this?

I wouldn't consider myself a Live "diehard" and I'd imagine many of those you have chosen to define as "hypocrites themselves" likely feel as I do. I became a fan of Live when I first was introduced to them because I enjoyed their music and their performances. Not because of Ed's views or that he was "pissing in the mainstream".

In my opinion, obviously not your's, Ed isn't necessarily a hypocrite. His current views/philsophies on issues might have changed. I don't know many people who have the same outlook on life as they age that they had when they were younger. Experiences and influences throughout one's life tends to mellow many.

I still enjoy his music and I hope to enjoy the music of The Gracious Few as well. I respect your right to feel as you do, but don't think you should peg all Ed fans as hypocrites because they follow his music still. Even if you do, or even if he is, I doubt that would discourage those who do intend to continue to support him. He's one hell of a performer and listening to his cd and watching him in concert brings a little pleasure into my life.

This post has been edited by livefan1999: Sep 9 2010, 2:03 pm

[SinfulEyes]

I wouldn't consider myself a Live "diehard" and I'd imagine many of those you have chosen to define as "hypocrites themselves" likely feel as I do. I became a fan of Live when I first was introduced to them because I enjoyed their music and their performances. Not because of Ed's views or that he was "pissing in the mainstream".

In my opinion, obviously not your's, Ed isn't necessarily a hypocrite. His current views/philsophies on issues might have changed. I don't know many people who have the same outlook on life as they age that they had when they were younger. Experiences and influences throughout one's life tends to mellow many.

I still enjoy his music and I hope to enjoy the music of The Gracious Few as well. I respect your right to feel as you do, but don't think you should peg all Ed fans as hypocrites because they follow his music still. Even if you do, or even if he is, I doubt that would discourage those who do intend to continue to support him. He's one hell of a performer and listening to his cd and watching him in concert brings a little pleasure into my life.

That is fair enough. I respect your opinion. The thread is mostly directed at fans of Ed who defend him to no end. In my opinion, he is indefensible.

[Chelsea]

I am not a fan of "Alive" but I also don't think the only choices are "Ed rules" or "Ed sucks", with the written message that anyone who disagrees is an idiot. It's so Beavis & Butthead ("that rules!" .... "no way, dude, that sucks!"). If people like "Alive" and want to see Ed solo in concert, then I get that. He's a dynamic performer with a great voice. That didn't change when he parted ways with Live.

I do get the "Ed sold out" charges, too. I really do. I find myself sad over not liking his new album and the charges of what he did to his fellow bandmates with contract fees and behind the scenes actions. I understand why the rest of Live filed a lawsuit. I understand the anger from fans.

I just think it's a waste of a great site to have too much Beavis & Butthead action going on. Most of us are adults and capable of having real discussions that don't dissolve into "STFU, dickhead!" replies. Some are fine, but it took me awhile to register here becuz I wasn't sure if it would be all arguments, all the time, ya know?

[PurdueSteve]

I've gotta say that the ones who still support him and consume his music and coffee paraphernalia are definitely hypocrites themselves.

I agree with your post and your main point, but this jumps out at me.

I disagree with this, I consume all sorts of media, that in message goes against how I may feel on a subject.

Politically, I fit in the libertarian camp (although I hate labels) and that by definition makes me disagree with the victim welfare-entitlement mentality of the poor culture in our country, yet, regardless, I still listen to some old and some new hip-hop! Does that make me a hypocrite for doing so, I don't think so.

I haven't bought into the whole global warming politically-charged science, yet I still watched and enjoyed the movie Avatar (although it in premise was a rip off of other stories). Does that make me a hypocrite because of it's Pro-green message.

Ed has changed and has taken actions that contradict some of his earlier claims in life. That doesn't necessarily make him a hypocrite, because to be a hypocrite is to say one thing WHILE doing another. So being anti-christian (or anti-organized religion) back in 1992 while turning to a christian in 2010 wouldn't make someone a hypocrite, rather just a person that changed their views.

Now, Ed IS a hypocrite for some of the things Fish pointed out.

Regardless, I don't think anyone listening to Ed's work today is a hypocrite. I think Alive sucks as a piece of work coming from Ed Kowalczyk who I know can do better, setting that aside it's not 100% garbage if you don't mind some pop-rock. I personally like Zion, Soul Whispers (horrible title) and Eat your love. I don't think that makes me a hypocrite, I take it for it is. I'd rather have the 1995 to 1997 Ed again, but since that ain't whats happening I, objectively, have to accept what is reality.

[SinfulEyes]

I agree with your post and your main point, but this jumps out at me.

I disagree with this, I consume all sorts of media, that in message goes against how I may feel on a subject.

Politically, I fit in the libertarian camp (although I hate labels) and that by definition makes me disagree with the victim welfare-entitlement mentality of the poor culture in our country, yet, regardless, I still listen to some old and some new hip-hop! Does that make me a hypocrite for doing so, I don't think so.

I haven't bought into the whole global warming politically-charged science, yet I still watched and enjoyed the movie Avatar (although it in premise was a rip off of other stories). Does that make me a hypocrite because of it's Pro-green message.

Ed has changed and has taken actions that contradict some of his earlier claims in life. That doesn't necessarily make him a hypocrite, because to be a hypocrite is to say one thing WHILE doing another. So being anti-christian (or anti-organized religion) back in 1992 while turning to a christian in 2010 wouldn't make someone a hypocrite, rather just a person that changed their views.

Now, Ed IS a hypocrite for some of the things Fish pointed out.

Regardless, I don't think anyone listening to Ed's work today is a hypocrite. I think Alive sucks as a piece of work coming from Ed Kowalczyk who I know can do better, setting that aside it's not 100% garbage if you don't mind some pop-rock. I personally like Zion, Soul Whispers (horrible title) and Eat your love. I don't think that makes me a hypocrite, I take it for it is. I'd rather have the 1995 to 1997 Ed again, but since that ain't whats happening I, objectively, have to accept what is reality.

Unfortunately, myself included, I have trouble getting over the fact that Ed has come to this. We all know he can write and produce a higher quality product.

I believe most of our angst stems this and the fact that he hasn't really written anything noteworthy since the TDTH days.

[OutToDry]

I used to think Ed was all that, his command over the audience, his art,...........is dead to me now. Has been for 10 years. Sell out? To what he became...yes.

[Bremang]

I think it is more that Eds songs just aren't as cool or catchy. Ed and Live have been very tactful with intent to sell from the second they decided to sign to a record label, or the day they decided to call themselves Public Affection and feast off a movement with their black coffee tapes. The ebb and flow of whatever was selling for them at the time had an effect on their music. The first 5 live albums were all a deviation from the last to the point that you could question their intent, but at least back then it all sounded great.

This post has been edited by Bremang: Sep 9 2010, 7:24 pm

[OutToDry]

The last record was an Ed solo record, shouldnt have been branded with the +LIVE+ logo.

[Chelsea]

I actually think "SFBM" gets a bad rap. Is it my favorite or even fourth favorite Live cd? Nope. But "Wings" is an incredible song. The lyrics in the chorus were part of what helped me change my attitude about something huge in my life and helped me to start travelling again (to a LIVE show out of town, to boot). I do think it's missing that something extra that could've put it over the top, and unless I'm hallucinating (ya never know), that point was brought up somewhere before (here, The Gracious Fans, FB?). Still, I love the song and remember elbowing my friend at the gig and saying, "This is that awesome new song I was telling you about" when they started playing it. I also like "The River".

There are plenty of weak moments on the album, too, but I think "V" is a weaker album.

Just my opinion.

[Bremang]

The last record was an Ed solo record, shouldnt have been branded with the +LIVE+ logo.

Maybe it should have been called Ed Kowalczyk and Live.

[OutToDry]

I actually think "SFBM" gets a bad rap. Is it my favorite or even fourth favorite Live cd? Nope. But "Wings" is an incredible song. The lyrics in the chorus were part of what helped me change my attitude about something huge in my life and helped me to start travelling again (to a LIVE show out of town, to boot). I do think it's missing that something extra that could've put it over the top, and unless I'm hallucinating (ya never know), that point was brought up somewhere before (here, The Gracious Fans, FB?). Still, I love the song and remember elbowing my friend at the gig and saying, "This is that awesome new song I was telling you about" when they started playing it. I also like "The River".

There are plenty of weak moments on the album, too, but I think "V" is a weaker album.

Just my opinion.

Wings is a good song. I like Night of Nights and Show. The rest was pure shit. None of it was really Live, it was Ed.