Live : Sad Facts, List Them Here Options

[Hoodstock]

If you have any actual facts about the band, that you would consider sad, list them here.

[Hoodstock]

My sad facts:

1. Live's last new song: Believe
2. Live's last full album : Songs From Black Mountain
3. Live's last single : Forever

Talk about leaving a bitter taste!

[Jon P]

my sad facts.

Ed signed a secret publishing deal behind the other three members backs and screwed them out of a ton of money.... singlehandley breaking up the band and causing disenchantment with fans worldwide!

FACT!

[Sakhmet2]

my sad facts.

Ed signed a secret publishing deal behind the other three members backs and screwed them out of a ton of money.... singlehandley breaking up the band and causing disenchantment with fans worldwide!

FACT!

Okay Mr. Insider, answer me this:
Did this "secret publishing deal" cover songs from past albums, or only new unreleased work? Was it all past albums, or only some recent ones? Did it apply only to lyrics, or lyrics and music? Was it that he was planning to continue writing songs alone - as Chad T said he has been doing for the past couple - then claim sole copyright for them, effectively turning his musical partners and mates into a (presumably salaried) backup band?

The reason I ask:
In most countries copyright resides with the originating artist unless they specifically alienate the copyright by selling it or otherwise giving the rights away. If Live as a band was listed as the creator/composer of the songs on all their albums to date, and they did not specifically sign away their portion of copyright to Ed or anyone else, how could he sign such a deal and have it apply to works of which they were the join owners?

I'm just curious.

[thefunkyredcaboose]

Okay Mr. Insider, answer me this:
Did this "secret publishing deal" cover songs from past albums, or only new unreleased work? Was it all past albums, or only some recent ones? Did it apply only to lyrics, or lyrics and music? Was it that he was planning to continue writing songs alone - as Chad T said he has been doing for the past couple - then claim sole copyright for them, effectively turning his musical partners and mates into a (presumably salaried) backup band?

The reason I ask:
In most countries copyright resides with the originating artist unless they specifically alienate the copyright by selling it or otherwise giving the rights away. If Live as a band was listed as the creator/composer of the songs on all their albums to date, and they did not specifically sign away their portion of copyright to Ed or anyone else, how could he sign such a deal and have it apply to works of which they were the join owners?

I'm just curious.

I don't think we'll ever know the specifics of the contract. What we do know is that it effected how much money the band received, and the band did not know about it. I think that's all we need to know about what happened.

[Merica]

They've effectively broken up.

[Sakhmet2]

I don't think we'll ever know the specifics of the contract. What we do know is that it effected how much money the band received, and the band did not know about it. I think that's all we need to know about what happened.

No it isn't all we need to know by a long shot!!!

If Ed was negotiating for stuff of which he claimed sole authorship and which had not already been recorded with the band then he was within his rights to do so - just as Chad, Chad and Patrick would be within their rights to claim copyright on anything they wrote without Ed.

His mates might have been hurt - just as the Doors were upset with Morrison at first when he wanted to divide writing credits for songs - because such arrangements always tend to leave some band members poorer than others since their share of royalties is diminished because they can only collect from performance of the work by themselves and not by other artists. (Drummers always come off the worst it seems )

On the other hand, it would be a far sleazier thing to try and alienate the rest of the band from copyright on songs which they wrote with him.

This post has been edited by Sakhmet2: Dec 6 2009, 6:14 pm

[thefunkyredcaboose]

No it isn't all we need to know by a long shot!!!

If Ed was negotiating for stuff of which he claimed sole authorship and which had not already been recorded with the band then he was within his rights to do so - just as Chad, Chad and Patrick would be within their rights to claim copyright on anything they wrote without Ed.

His mates might have been hurt - just as the Doors were upset with Morrison at first when he wanted to divide writing credits for songs - because such arrangements always tend to leave some band members poorer than others since their share of royalties is diminished because they can only collect from performance of the work by themselves and not by other artists. (Drummers always come off the worst it seems )

On the other hand, it would be a far sleazier thing to try and alienate the rest of the band from copyright on songs which they wrote with him.

The reason that doesn't matter is because the deal was signed in 2005 and the other guys did not know about it until 2009. Re-negotiating the songwriting contract with the band is common practice, re-negotiating in secret is far from common and completely underhanded.

It would be interesting to know the specifics, but signing any contract that effects the band without their knowledge is sleazy.

[Wambangalang]

im with you sakhmet2. These are the kinds of details people need to understand before alligning ed with stalin

[Pokey]

im with you sakhmet2. These are the kinds of details people need to understand before alligning ed with stalin

If you were in Ed's position right now, would you address the problem via something like a blog update? Or would you be happy for people to make up their own minds and speculate about you?

[thefunkyredcaboose]

im with you sakhmet2. These are the kinds of details people need to understand before alligning ed with stalin

I'm not aligning Ed with Stalin, just drawing conclusions based on what has come out thus far. The lack of a rebuttal from Ed is pretty telling, especially considering the legal ramifications.

We may not know until the lawsuit has run its course, unless Ed breaks his silence.

Saying "its not true LOL" does not really inspire much confidence.

[Sakhmet2]

The reason that doesn't matter is because the deal was signed in 2005 and the other guys did not know about it until 2009. Re-negotiating the songwriting contract with the band is common practice, re-negotiating in secret is far from common and completely underhanded.

It would be interesting to know the specifics, but signing any contract that effects the band without their knowledge is sleazy.

IF it was a contract that affected the band as a whole. I return to my question about HOW Ed could have signed or negotiated anything at any time if he did not have sole copyright on the material involved. Even a non-lawyer with a modicum of knowledge would know to check to see if someone has the right to make an agreement before they sign it. And we can all agree that Ed did not have sole copyright on anything done with the band.

What, then, was he negotiating for? It seems like a solo career, basically. And while it's not great that he did this without the band's knowledge, it's a whole different kettle of fish from rooking them out of thousands of dollars, as some people here are claiming.

[Wambangalang]

If you were in Ed's position right now, would you address the problem via something like a blog update? Or would you be happy for people to make up their own minds and speculate about you?

hell yeah!! I'd be dancing around my hotel room naked throwing my millions of dollars in the air and rolling around in it while singing kum-ba-ya!

Ahh, all that money...

[Pokey]

hell yeah!! I'd be dancing around my hotel room naked throwing my millions of dollars in the air and rolling around in it while singing kum-ba-ya!

Ahh, all that money...

Ok ... wasnt quite what I asked haha
So really then you shouldn't care if people paint Ed as stallin because he has lots of money?

[Bremang]

How quickly people forget how awesome Ed is, and how he deserves every penny.