gotigrz's - 'Jesus is the only way to heaven' thread, split from "Is Ed... a Christian Again?" Options

[gotigrz]

Why are they more blessed? (as this seems to imply)

well, if you're really interested, read this page. about half way down it asks the very question you just did. do me a favor.... read this page i linked. i am a Christian, but i also know that i'm probably not the best person to talk to about this stuff as i am pretty hard headed. sometimes, actually, a lot of times i need help in expressing what i'm trying to say without sounding judgemental or overbearing... which, honestly, i'm not trying to do.

http://www.online-literature.com/charles-k...and-country/35/

[Pokey]

oh FFS I'm not reading all that, can you copy and paste the part that pretains to the question?

I find it funny how so many people have such strong faith and conviction and love for God yet when asked with the hard questions they still can't answer them ... no one is asking you to be a literary genius or anything or to come up with an answer that is in the absolute best wording possible, but surely to believe it or to believe the contrary to what I asked you'd still be able to offer an answer of your own.

[thefunkyredcaboose]

This has all taken an odd and funny turn.

[gotigrz]

oh FFS I'm not reading all that, can you copy and paste the part that pretains to the question?

like i said, if you're REALLY interested... read it yourself. it's not an answer that i can just cut and paste... it makes you think and come to your own conclusion to the question.

I find it funny how so many people have such strong faith and conviction and love for God yet when asked with the hard questions they still can't answer them


actually, i've never been asked that question or even thought about it. but, my initial thought was.... "that's a good question". i didn't know the answer. i don't know the answer to a lot of questions. and, when i don't know the answer to a question... i seek it. is there a problem with that?

i have a question for you. what is it about "God" that turns you off? don't say the people that believe it are always shoving it down my throat... this isn't a question about the believers but about God, Himself?

[crazy1]

Pokey, don't you know? It means they can run around shoving their personal beliefs down everyone's throat while being spared the eternal Hell that we are all going to because we aren't conservative evangelicals.

Don't worry we are just going to Christian Hell. All our friends will be there!!!

This post has been edited by crazy1: May 14 2009, 11:18 am

[thefunkyredcaboose]

Don't worry we are just going to Christian Hell. All our friends will be there!!!

And Adam and Eve, Moses, Noah, and Abraham...!

[Pokey]

i have a question for you. what is it about "God" that turns you off? don't say the people that believe it are always shoving it down my throat... this isn't a question about the believers but about God, Himself?

Fair enough..

I was brought up as a Catholic, I went to a Catholic primary and secondary school .. so from as young as I can remember I was always brought up being told that Jesus was the way, and hell I didn't know any different, I think it's wrong to push beliefs on kids at that impresionable age, you don't really have the ability to decide for yourself and things you are taught at that age can make a big impact.

So really up until I was about 13 or 14 I truely believed in God, I prayed, I went to Mass (sometimes) so yeah I think I have a fairly good understanding of what it's like to be a Christian. But when things got really rough for me at that age I just suddenly found no solace in God at all .. all the praying and the faith seemed to mean absolutely nothing. The Catholic school I went to did nothing to help matters, rather than helping me they just kicked me out at the first sign of trouble. So I really for the first time began to actually look at the world of spirituality and religion outside of my own, I honestly didn't find very much in any religion .. some nice ideals (even in Christianity there are) but as far as a God went I found nothing.
It just felt that everything I was told was the truth was only someone telling me what someone else told them, and then someone told them and so on and so on .. and unlike being taught maths or science where you can see physical outcomes to what you're being taught ... there was nothing for religion, you just "had to believe" ... I couldn't deal with the concept of blind faith.
You can argue that "well maybe you prayed to God and he answered and you just didn't listen to the answer!!" or "But you prayed for Love and eventuall found love!" or something, well .. who's to say that it wasn't Ganesh that answered my prayer or Buddha or Mohammed or fucking Zenu?

Then I looked at how I was brought up, and I think .. if I was brought up and told Jesus is the way right from birth, I'm sure there are Indian kids being brought up being told that Hinduism is the way .. and I think, well if one or the other was the true way, then wouldn't the light from that religion and truth shine so brightly that regardless of what you're told when you're a kid, you should end up seeing the light of the true Lord and gravitating towards them?
The fact we have so many religions with people who all believe that the way they follow is the true way and there are people out there that follow religions different to yours yet their faith is just as strong as yours .. well hell to me thats a pretty big sign that there just can't be one true way.

So basically I guess you can say I just fell out with God and am honestly not convinced by anything now that I have been taught to be the truth is proof enough he exists.

To me I don't believe in worshipping anyone or anything (besides Morrissey ) ... I'm gonna live my life to the best of my ability, be the best person I can be and should there be some kind of God or entity or whatever at the end of it all, let me be judged on how I lived, not how I worshipped.

I guess Christians annoy me more than most other religions simpley because that's my past and I feel bitter about the way I was brought up on it. I feel more strongly towards being negative about that particular religion than any others even though I don't think it makes any more or less sense than a lot of other religions.

This post has been edited by Pokey: May 14 2009, 11:50 am

[gotigrz]

ok, i understand what you're saying and why, i guess, you feel the way you do. but, as a Christian, i am suppose to try my best to point someone in the direction of Christ. that's all i'm doing.

you told my why you don't believe in God. so, i'm gonna tell you why i do. a lot of people say... "that's just the way you were brought up so that's what you're gonna believe". well, weren't you brought up to believe? and, do you.

i was brought up to believe. and, yes, that's what got me pointed in that direction, but that's not why i believe. i believe cause i've seen God work in ways that are almost unexplainable... but, i'll try.

i use to dip. i knew it was bad for me, and i knew i should quit. i prayed that God would take the "want" i had for dip away from me. i don't want dip anymore.

i use to smoke the cheeba... again, i prayed that God would take that from me. i don't smoke it or want it anymore.

i have a house over my head, a great wife, a wonderful son. i attribute these things as blessings from God. i don't know why i'm so lucky as to live in this country and have these things that so many people in other countries dont... but, i know that i don't deserve these things. i'm blessed.

when i was 15 i started listening to LIVE... well, sometime in 2007(i think) i guess i got fet up with ed lyrics being so wishy washy as far as what it is that he's actually saying he believes. cause, as a Christian... i didn't want to sing along to songs that may be saying things that go directly against what it is that i believe in. so, as much as i loved the music... i had to give it up. and, i'll admit.. it's been the hardest thing to do. which made me realize that i was addicted to this music. so, i prayed that God would take the "want" i had for this music, and, not as easily, but He did. i still like the music, but i believe that God made it so that i cant' listen to it in the same way i use to. i don't enjoy it like i use to. and, that's exactly what i asked for. well, after i felt that that prayer had been answered... i turned my prayer in another direction. i honestly felt that ed kowalczyk was "lost" and whether i was right or wrong... i prayed that he would find Jesus. and, if what i've read recently... that prayer has been answered.

and then there's the world around me. i just don't believe this world is as beautiful as it is by pure luck. i don't believe that some bugs just got lucky and look just like bark on a tree for their safety. or that flowers bloom into something so beautiful "just cause". or, everything about us works so perfectly from our brains telling our toes to curl to our eyes closing just in the nick of time so that something doesn't hit it. or the fact that there are billions of people in the world and every one has two eyes, two arms, two legs, one nose, hair, a mouth... yet we all look so different.

i just don't believe that this whole entire universe "works" as perfectly as it does... and, nothing or nobody is in charge of it. i just don't believe that. and, if i believe that someone (God) is in charge of this world... created it and everything in it... then why should i not believe that He can do anything and everything else,... including communicating with the people of His creation?

[thefunkyredcaboose]

You do know you can believe all of those things without damning everyone else to hell right?

[gotigrz]

You do know you can believe all of those things without damning everyone else to hell right?

much like someone said that i was judging everyone... please show me where i said that anyone was going to hell. do i beleive that people go to hell? yes. but, i havent' said that you or anyone else is going to hell. i'm not the eternal judge.

[LiveRoCkS77]

I think gotgriz is just trying to explain his point of view, nothing wrong with that. I haven't seen any particular instance where he said any of you are wrong and he is right. He just seems to be speaking in what the context of his religion believes. I don't see him pushing it on any of you neither.

I actually commend him for being calm and trying to explain himself in the face of all you guys attacking him. not all of you, but some.

Nice to see a sane, rational discussion on this board for a change. Continue please...

[gotigrz]

I think gotgriz is just trying to explain his point of view, nothing wrong with that. I haven't seen any particular instance where he said any of you are wrong and he is right. He just seems to be speaking in what the context of his religion believes. I don't see him pushing it on any of you neither.




thank you. as a Christian, i'm called to witness the word of God. not push it on anyone... just tell it how i see it. i don't go around knocking on doors, or hand out "do you know where you would go if you died today" pamplets... i just heard that ed had decided to accept Jesus as his saviour... and, i just felt like rejoicing in that.

[thefunkyredcaboose]

Go Tigrz,

If I don't believe Jesus is the only way to salvation, am I going to Hell?

[crazy1]

Only Christian hell...
I think gotigrzs is just so happy that he can listen to Live now without going to hell! Right?!

[gotigrz]

Go Tigrz,

If I don't believe Jesus is the only way to salvation, am I going to Hell?

nice try on the "set up" question, but i'm gonna answer anyway. i'm a Christian, i believe that the bible is God's inspired word. i believe in Jesus and everything He taught. Jesus said, ....not me, not tom, nor dick nor harry,..... John 14:6 - 6Jesus answered, "I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me." and, i, being a Christian, am suppose to try to be like Jesus as much as i can. and, Jesus said John 3:17 - 17"For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved".

all i know is that, according to God, Jesus, and the written inspired word of God... you must accept Christ as your saviour in order to be saved.

sooo... are you going to hell.... i don't know.. that'll be for God to decide.

This post has been edited by gotigrz: May 14 2009, 3:39 pm