Do you believe in God? Options

[burd]

I think there is more to life than we can see. There is no proof either way, but I do believe that there is an afterlife. I definitely do believe in spirits. I never understood why people were so against GOD. Even if a higher power didn't exist, the thought provides comfort for many. Unless you can say 100 percent in either direction, there is no reason to shoot down others beliefs.

At this point in the game, I'd say a definite lack of proof IS proof. And uh ... ever hear of Charles Darwin? Evolution? Biology? Science?



Thanks Heather. *high five*

[SJN1279]

At this point in the game, I'd say a definite lack of proof IS proof. And uh ... ever hear of Charles Darwin? Evolution? Biology? Science?
Thanks Heather. *high five*

Science is a great tool, but will never be able to explain all of life's mysteries. The universe isn't black and white, there are many shades of gray. I've always believed there is more to life that what we can see. Evolution doesn't explain away the existence of spirits or the numerous accounts of similar near death experiences among many very different people.

We are all free to believe what we like, but should respect others beliefs as well.

[burd]

That's all fine - but none of that has anything to do with god.
I'm not disrespecting anyone - I just think it's really fucking sad that people would rather believe in an unknown rather than themselves.

[SJN1279]

That's all fine - but none of that has anything to do with god.
I'm not disrespecting anyone - I just think it's really fucking sad that people would rather believe in an unknown rather than themselves.

You can believe in both. Sometimes things are out of control and you can't do anything about it. It never hurts to pray to a higher power. However, I do agree that some people take things too far, but it is perfectly fine to have faith in a higher power and also believe in themself.

[burd]

Well I don't think it's perfectly fine to have faith in a higher power. If it's wrong for me to expect people to employ a touch of logic & rational thought, then I don't want to be right. Those are MY beliefs. And according to you, "there is no reason to shoot down others beliefs".

[SJN1279]

Well I don't think it's perfectly fine to have faith in a higher power. If it's wrong for me to expect people to employ a touch of logic & rational thought, then I don't want to be right. Those are MY beliefs. And according to you, "there is no reason to shoot down others beliefs".

So if you have a friend or family member who is dying and they take comfort in a belief in a higher power, are you going to argue with that person?

[burd]

That's really fucking low, Nick. Not that it's any of your business, but my friends & family members know what my deal is. And don't introduce a scenario where someone in my life is on their death bed, thinking you're going to show that I'm a hypocrit. This is a simple (with extra emphasis on the word SIMPLE) conversation on a message board. You wouldn't like it if I asked you if you'd argue with your dying relative. One has nothing to do with the other.

[SJN1279]

That's really fucking low, Nick. Not that it's any of your business, but my friends & family members know what my deal is. And don't introduce a scenario where someone in my life is on their death bed, thinking you're going to show that I'm a hypocrit. This is a simple (with extra emphasis on the word SIMPLE) conversation on a message board. You wouldn't like it if I asked you if you'd argue with your dying relative. One has nothing to do with the other.

I didn't produce that scenario to show you being a hypocrite. I wanted to know your honest response would be to that situation. And whenever you bring the existence of GOD into a discussion, it is never a SIMPLE conversation.

[Wambangalang]

"I don't believe in any of Earth's monotheistic religions, but I do believe that one can construct an intriguing scientific definition of God, once you accept the fact that there are approximately 100 billion stars in our galaxy alone, that each star is a life-giving sun and that there are approximately 100 billion galaxies in just the visible universe. Given a planet in a stable orbit, not too hot and not too cold, and given a few billion years of chance chemical reactions created by the interaction of a sun's energy on the planet's chemicals, it's fairly certain that life in one form or another will eventually emerge. It's reasonable to assume that there must be, in fact, countless billions of such planets where biological life has arisen, and the odds of some
proportion of such life developing intelligence are high. Now, the sun is by no means an old star, and its planets are mere children in cosmic age, so it seems likely that there are billions of planets in the
universe not only where intelligent life is on a lower scale than man but other billions where it is approximately equal and others still where it is hundreds of thousands of millions of years in advance of us. When you think of the giant technological strides that man has made in a few millennia -- less than a microsecond in the chronology of the universe -- can you imagine the evolutionary development that much
older life forms have taken? They may have progressed from biological species, which are fragile shells for the mind at best, into immortal machine entities -- and then, over innumerable eons, they could emerge
from the chrysalis of matter transformed into beings of pure energy and spirit. Their potentialities would be limitless and their intelligence ungraspable by humans."

Stanley Kubrick on the concept of god and its place in the film '2001: A Space Odyssey'

thats pretty much how i feel

[mahaffey]

I do. I've seen to many unusual things and had too many unusual experiences. I also think that the famous Christian leaders need to teach more about the social-economic problems then trying to scare everyone to believing (stupid "ministers" using politics to change the main message of Jesus from poverty and helping the poor to gay marriage and abortion).

Why can't religion and science co-exist? I just don't get that one.

This post has been edited by mahaffey: Oct 8 2006, 10:33 pm

[FishOutaWater]

The answer to that question depends on what the meaning of "God" is. And "God" means something different to every person based on subtle differences in the paradigm you bring to the table. Thus, I think it is realistic to say that no person believes in the same "God" that any other person believes in. Once we name it, define it, describe it, form thoughts around something to "believe in", we immediately change it, limit it, defile it.

And what does it mean to "believe in" God. Does that mean "to believe that a set of facts are true"? Are we talking about believing in God like we used to believe in Santa Clause and the Tooth Fairy. It used to be, a long time ago, that "belief" in God or in Jesus didn't mean "I believe that a certain set of facts are true", but rather the very definition of the word belief in its root form meant "I accept it into my heart, as a part of me". Thus a belief in God meant that one accepted a path of "Godliness" (be it compassion and love or whatever) into one's being, and adopting that "belief" became a transformative experience. Somehow, somewhere along the way, religious belief went from a path of transformation to some kind of life-long juvenile believe in a salvation Santa Clause.

Physics tells us that it is true that everything in the universe is one big cosmic dance of energy. We know what we perceieve in the physical word is not really physical matter at the subatomic level, but rather is made up of "stuff" that we can't understand that manifests characteristics of both particals, and energy and can be converted from matter to energy and vice versa. So who are we and what is that cosmic energy whose flow carries the dance of life? For thousands of years, mystics and the great teachers of spiritual wisdom have described us all as one. And they have described God as one. And from that oneness arises compassion and love for all things, because, as one, it makes no sense to hate or judge or do harm. Now, modern physics confirms what the spiritual teachers have spoken of long before those thoughts could be confirmed. The ying and yang. The universal consciousness and chi energy. Four thousand years ago, the Jewish prayer called the "shema" spoke of God as one. Not meaning one God (as opposed to many), but rather that God is one with all things. This is what is meant by "love your neighbor as yourself". And yes the world is fucked up. But it is through a practice of loving kindness and compassion as the buddhists describe, tikkum ha-olam - or repairing the world as the Jews call it, or the good deeds and loving thy neighbor as yourself as Jesus described, which is the purpose of life.

What do I believe? I believe that I don't know a description of God. No one does. It's like trying to get a cock roach to explain complicated calculus. I think that using a name for God or personifying God as a man, a father, a king, or a judge, just takes me farther from the mark. I just try to practice the principals that Lao Tsu, Jesus, the Buddha, the veddas and the Jewish prophets all taught, all of which are beautiful and instructive expressions in response to a direct connection to the divine. I try to rest in the experience of the present moment as much as possible, because that is all there is, without becoming a victim of the grasping, clinging, fearing and distracting of the ego mind which takes me farther away from the oneness that is.

What I don't believe is that if a person happens to form a belief that a set of facts are true, that he or she will go to heaven in the afterlife and if he or she doesn't believe those things to be true, he or she will burn in hell for all eternity. I can't accept that all of eternity is dependant upon the distinctly human and random process of neuro-cognative conditioning to form a belief in a set of facts.

This post has been edited by FishOutaWater: Oct 10 2006, 8:31 am

[ladylakini17]

yes i do very strongly believe in God and Jesus Christ....i dont really like getting into it with other people though because there are always arguments and disagreements...and religion is the thing that i hate to argue about the most...

although i do respect others opinions and the fact that not everyone believes in a God.

[Kymra]

Great, great post Todd.

I dunno - I asked cause I'm having such a hard time understanding how the christian right is swaying the U.S so much ( in the wrong direction, imho). I mean, do people really believe that 'God' created the universe in 7 Days??? Come on now......

There's a cool song that Roger Waters wrote a few years ago about a time when he was young that he hitchhiked through Europe and ended up in Lebanon when his car broke down. A very generous and kind Lebanese family took him in for the night, and the song is inspired by that experience.
This is a verse from it -

Is gentleness too much for us
Should gentleness be filed along with empathy
We feel for someone else's child
Every time a smart bomb does its sums and gets it wrong
Someone else's child dies and equities in defence rise
America, America, please hear us when we call
You got hip-hop, be-bop, hustle and bustle
You got Atticus Finch
You got Jane Russell
You got freedom of speech
You got great beaches, wildernesses and malls
Don't let the might, the Christian right, fuck it all up
For you and the rest of the world

[seriakiLLa]

I always thought that evolution was/is part of the process of creation. So yes, it is ridiculous to think that after '7 days'... voila! everything is here.

[Kymra]

I always thought that evolution was/is part of the process of creation. So yes, it is ridiculous to think that after '7 days'... voila! everything is here.

As I understand it, no. Christians believe that the world was created in 7 days by God. Which, of course, is an absurd notion.