Chris Shinn interview on Rockonomics podcast Options

[Hoodstock]

Chris basically said they asked him to help to make songs commercially available, went on to do money / cash grab gigs that he didn't feel they needed to do, and didn't really care about being a band that did new music. They did an album because he pushed that they could.

We all saw they put out an album they really never tried to promote.

They then went back to Ed, didn't really put a ton of effort during 2 1/2 years into new music, then did a nostalgia tour with a band they allegedly said they would never tour with again. Now we are anticipating the release of TC anniversary stuff next year.

If you buy what Chris was saying it screams this band is not that serious about new stuff and that this is a play to cash in on the Live brand again ... just like some here have said from the beginning.

I'm hoping for an active band putting out new material and fully supporting it, but it sounds like (and seems to appear right now) that won't be the case. Looks like they have resigned to being a nastolgia act.

Not what I was hoping for but it appears to be what it is.

This post has been edited by Hoodstock: Nov 29 2018, 4:33 pm

[Voodoo Lady]

They then went back to Ed, didn't really put a ton of effort during 2 1/2 years into new music, then did a nostalgia tour with a band they allegedly said they would never tour with again. Now we are anticipating the release of TC anniversary stuff next year.

If you buy what Chris was saying it screams this band is not that serious about new stuff and that this is a play to cash in on the Live brand again ... just like some here have said from the beginning.

I'm hoping for an active band putting out new material and fully supporting it, but it sounds like (and seems to appear right now) that won't be the case. Looks like they have resigned to being a nastolgia act.

This is what has infuriated me the last 2 1/2 years. I really don’t care what went on with Shinn or how it went sour. What I do care about is that they got Ed back, have all 4 original members and didn’t capitalize on the reunion hype. They could have done SO much more.

I had the opportunity to go to Kaboo Cayman with a friend who is into Duran Duran. No WAY am I paying money to go at peak season to see the same lazy setlist.

This post has been edited by Voodoo Lady: Nov 29 2018, 3:16 pm

[Voodoo Lady]

Ok I lied about you having last word lol. You said it was natural that a band would disregard their own record with a new singer.

Yes, because it would be disrespectful. So if you want to make that all about Ed, fair enough.

You said you know of one band that did....ok. Can you name several more?

Not without research, because I’m no Eddie Trunk, naming off trivia off the top of my head. But lots of bands have been ashamed of certain members, not lead singers per say.

Because there have been many bands through the years that changed line-ups, including new singers, and chose not to disregard their own work so I would not say it is natural, just a decision they made. And that is a huge decision.

Maybe not as huge as we’re making it out to be. We don’t know yet. As said, it’s probably, “Eh, I don’t want to seem really disrespectful to my childhood friend right now that he’s just getting back in the band.

Months of writing and touring and hard work just to pretend it did not happen and to pull it away from the fans after releasing it with no warning or explanation.

They definitely didn’t tour for months.

If you can think of a better reason than Ed,in all seriousness, I would like to know considering that decision corresponded with the return of Ed. Without ANY explanation from the band on why they chose to do this all we have is speculation, which we have the right to do seeing as how we are the reason they have careers. If they do not like it they could choose to be more forthcoming. Besides, and this is more speculating, but I do not think Chris is going to get any more attention bringing up drama with a band that has not been relevant in two decades. As much as I love Live most people have no idea who they are. Ok for realsy I am through...possibly

Perhaps Shinn upset them some way and they don’t want to explain to avoid airing dirty laundry. So Chad T. publicly complimented him. Because no matter what it was, he still respects him as a person. I 100% don’t think they just used him for money.

[drewgood]

There are always three sides to a story. One half, the other half, and what really happened.

But I have to admit, I find myself easily believing Chris.

[promiseIma Livefan]

Yes, because it would be disrespectful. So if you want to make that all about Ed, fair enough. Not without research, because I’m no Eddie Trunk, naming off trivia off the top of my head. But lots of bands have been ashamed of certain members, not lead singers per say.

Maybe not as huge as we’re making it out to be. We don’t know yet. As said, it’s probably, “Eh, I don’t want to seem really disrespectful to my childhood friend right now that he’s just getting back in the band.

They definitely didn’t tour for months.
Perhaps Shinn upset them some way and they don’t want to explain to avoid airing dirty laundry. So Chad T. publicly complimented him. Because no matter what it was, he still respects him as a person. I 100% don’t think they just used him for money.

We are never going to agree, but two points. They did not go on a months long tour, but over the course of several months they performed multiple venues both inside and outside the U.S. as far as CCP deciding on their own to disregard The Turn to respect Ed, this is possible. However, as you say they are childhood friends so they know him therefore if they chose to do this on their own it’s because they knew they had to in order to protect his feelings. Ed voluntarily left Live so why would he have any reason to be upset they recorded an album without him. Oh that’s right, fragile ego. So the choice was to respect Ed and in turn disrespect their fans that appreciated the best Live album that had come out in years? No explanations. No heads up. Just one day it’s gone. Again, a shitty thing to do. Maybe Shinn did do something that upset them, and if so that could explain some things, but at least with him they were able to make real rock music.

[mattyeagles]

We are never going to agree, but two points. They did not go on a months long tour, but over the course of several months they performed multiple venues both inside and outside the U.S. as far as CCP deciding on their own to disregard The Turn to respect Ed, this is possible. However, as you say they are childhood friends so they know him therefore if they chose to do this on their own it’s because they knew they had to in order to protect his feelings. Ed voluntarily left Live so why would he have any reason to be upset they recorded an album without him. Oh that’s right, fragile ego. So the choice was to respect Ed and in turn disrespect their fans that appreciated the best Live album that had come out in years? No explanations. No heads up. Just one day it’s gone. Again, a shitty thing to do. Maybe Shinn did do something that upset them, and if so that could explain some things, but at least with him they were able to make real rock music.

I’m just SHOCKED to hear that maybe CCP are also a$$holes. Who would’ve thought!!! Probably Ed’s fault anyway, even though he wasn’t on that tour. No way those guys have ever done anything wrong, ever.

[Bremang]

And what was ever verified, said or published to confirm that Live will recognize The Turn again one day in the future? Again, I agree there is always more to the story than what we publicly know. I was directly responding to you saying what Chris did was fishy (per your reasoning we do not know why he waited this long to say something so why judge?); however, CCP has been doing "fishy" things for a couple of decades now. Bottom line is, whatever CCP's reasoning was, if you put your heart and soul into something and then its as if it never happened OF COURSE its going to be upsetting. Peace, and you may have the last word if you choose

everyone agrees with this.

we disagree when you claimed Ed's ego was definitely the reason for the turn being brought down. Good theory but we can't be sure.

[Bremang]

Can we really say that Live has wiped away The Turn? Plenty of bands removes their music from streaming media and iTunes. Plenty of albums are no longer in print. It's not like discographies can be wiped away. Look at any legit third party like Allmusic, Discogs, or Wiki.

Everyone who wanted to hear The Turn has heard it. There's not really going to be much interest in it other than the cult fans who already bought in. It's still on Youtube, and if you really want to find it in higher quality just ask a Live fan to share it.

If you're going to do a reunion tour with your original lead singer, and the first thing a fan sees on streaming media is Chris Shinn as the most recent album, that is going to be very confusing to the casuals. I can see the commercial reasons to drop it.

And in a way, this will make The Turn's return more impactful, so why not get rid of it for a bit?

This post has been edited by Bremang: Nov 29 2018, 9:17 pm

[mattyeagles]

Can we really say that Live has wiped away The Turn? Plenty of bands removes their music from streaming media and iTunes. Plenty of albums are no longer in print. It's not like discographies can be wiped away. Look at any legit third party like Allmusic, Discogs, or Wiki.

Everyone who wanted to hear The Turn has heard it. There's not really going to be much interest in it other than the cult fans who already bought in. It's still on Youtube, and if you really want to find it in higher quality just ask a Live fan to share it.

If you're going to do a reunion tour with your original lead singer, and the first thing a fan sees on streaming media is Chris Shinn as the most recent album, that is going to be very confusing to the casuals. I can see the commercial reasons to drop it.

And in a way, this will make The Turn's return more impactful, so why not get rid of it for a bit?

Exactly. Let’s keep in mind they also considered RE-RECORDING classic live songs out of spite.

[Bremang]

Exactly. Let's keep in mind they also considered RE-RECORDING classic live songs out of spite.

No. I was speculating that removing the Turn was not spiteful. Just financially driven and to not confuse the casuals.

Wouldn't mind if you would recognize that whether spite is involved is also just a theory.

I think their primary motivation with re-recording was just to make money off the songs. Chris said CCP had recently acquired rights to their catalogue and wanted to redo the tracks for commercial purposes. Ed and CCP had just finished their lawsuit where CCP demanded millions of dollars in damages from Ed. Re-recording was probably the only way they could make money off the tracks without paying Ed.

This post has been edited by Bremang: Nov 29 2018, 10:30 pm

[mattyeagles]

No. I was speculating that removing the Turn was not spiteful. Just financially driven and to not confuse the casuals.

Wouldn't mind if you would recognize that whether spite is involved is also just a theory.

I think their primary motivation with re-recording was just to make money off the songs. Chris said CCP had recently acquired rights to their catalogue and wanted to redo the tracks for commercial purposes. Ed and CCP had just finished their lawsuit where CCP demanded millions of dollars in damages from Ed. Re-recording was probably the only way they could make money off the tracks without paying Ed.

Fair enough. I misunderstood your point.

Chat just posted a Video on insta mentioning new music and tour dates, that’s exciting

[Bremang]

And, when a company is founded by a convicted conman, it also ain't a good sign. Any takers?

I'm always alone on this one, but I still like considering that maybe all of this is an elaborate con.

Chris Shinn, the sweet-hearted, very emotional, wannabe rockstar multi-millionaire seems like an easy mark for a conman. As conmen of all trades tend to seek out wealthy people in general.
All Live had to do was fake a breakup, pretend to fall in love with Chris, pitch him on United Fiber, and boom, you have a big investor.

Faking a breakup has all kinds of perks. Live was in a pitfall in their career. Ed couldn't sustain the classic Live sound any longer. So split the fanbase, double the exposure, and get a massive conversation rolling with the fans. All press is good press sometimes. It also keeps people distracted from realizing that Live would not come close to meeting expectations of the 90's anymore. Ask any of these fake beefing rappers know how much a good beef helps their career.

All they had to do was make up some bullshit about a lead singer bonus. And then ask any lawyer, it really wouldn't be difficult to write up a couple Complaints and file it in superior court. Ed has plausible deniability by saying he can't discuss the situation at all because there is an ongoing lawsuit, which conveniently took forever to resolve.

Meanwhile Ed goes on a bunch of world tours with a couple albums and fans love him. CCP get to finally rock out again with singers who can handle the music. They get to hype up a reformation of Live and they go on the Summerland tour. Both parties cash in on separate Throwing Copper reunion shows. And of course the return of Ed in the band makes a huge splash and helps them get great billing at festivals which pay a ton.

And when you get Chris involved, if you listen to that interview, maybe CCP and Ed knew how much Chris dreamed of finally making it. He would give anything. After spending all those years drinking, after all those extremely regrettable decisions which left him without a famous band, he said Live was his lifeline. What would he give to stay in CCP's good graces? Why wouldn't Chris opt in to make alot of money with a fiber optic company. No sweat, he's got plenty of cash.

Surely Bill Hynes couldn't have been involved in the plotting, right?

Sounds like a great financial plan compared to Ed and CCP remaining together in Live back in 2009 as they spiral way downhill.



Either that or feel free to believe in the current story.

I guess you would rather believe that CCP dropped their lifelong friend Ed because of a lead singer bonus and a secret contract, after an ultimatum that Ed forced upon them, which CCP sheepishly agreed to and suffered for years in the mid 2000s because the three of them together are oh so battered and emotionally defenseless. Chad Gracey and Pat just submitted to Ed's demands. Upon the breakup both parties completely shit on each other and swear to never be involved with each other again. Chad Gracey cries several times about being put behind a glass cage to protect Ed's "wittle ears" when actually the glass cage serves a different purpose and there's nothing wrong with it. Chad T. goes on huge public rants in his blog "by accident." CCP find Chris and they love him. Ed suddenly loves being solo and truly Christian in his heart. Then CCP pull a 180 and hate Chris, dump him and hide the music, and they love Ed to pieces cause they had a beer at a restaurant. Ed pulls a 180 and swears off Christianity. Only then to have Ed come and take full credit with outsider Zak Loy in the songwriting, having sideshow drummers in studio and on tour (two drummers on stage!)after CCP were vehemently fighting with fans online, as well as extrapolating in all the lawsuits, claiming each member of Live was essential and contributed equally, demanded to be paid 25% a piece, and that Live would always be the sum of four equal parts, and that it would always be this equation. Now Gracey doesn't even drum half the time.


I would never underestimate Ed, CCP, or Bill when it comes to manipulation. Who knows how many people Live have to support and guide their career. Ever since Public Affection, these guys have taken a special fondness to public perception. Just look at those old public affection newsletters.They lie in almost every interview from day one.



This post has been edited by Bremang: Nov 30 2018, 2:40 am

[drewgood]

"He Could Teach the Devil Tricks" takes on a whole new meaning now, doesn't it.

[+Ed+]

Bre, getting back to what you said yesterday, I, for one, consider myself a fan (once a die-hard). All I see is a band trying to hide or erase (or whatever) an album from their discography not to get the casuals confused about what has been going on. On the one hand it gets me a bit angry to see that as they are simply fooling people. On another hand, could not care less as if they wanted to destroy all the CDs with The Turn, they would have to find me. As one of those is officially in Russia.

[Bremang]

Bre, getting back to what you said yesterday, I, for one, consider myself a fan (once a die-hard). All I see is a band trying to hide or erase (or whatever) an album from their discography not to get the casuals confused about what has been going on. On the one hand it gets me a bit angry to see that as they are simply fooling people. On another hand, could not care less as if they wanted to destroy all the CDs with The Turn, they would have to find me. As one of those is officially in Russia.

Keeping the turn confuses the casuals, removing the turn confuses fans who expect to see shinn in the discography.

Didnt ccp not have v, bop, or sfbm for sale on the website when they were feuding w ed?