What to expect from +Live+..., now that Ed is back Options

[throwing_cheetahs]

Here's what's gonna happen: Nobody has a freakin clue!

[mfitz804]

Here's what's gonna happen: Nobody has a freakin clue!

Finally something I agree with.

[SJN1279]

Here's what's gonna happen: Nobody has a freakin clue!

Hopefully they do!

[alexou]

I'm sure they do....again, Ed didn't spend these days in York for that radio interview alone or that teenager cover act from last week. Seemed that all the members were there. Will be in 2017 I guess but they know.

[throwing_cheetahs]

Hopefully they do!

I'm sure they do, i know we don't.

[Merica]

I'm all for a reunited Live leading to the release of some old gems. Whether for anniversaries or just some ad-hoc dropping of goodies - that's all fine by me. Bring it on.

But moving forward, I can't imagine they won't put out some new music. There'll be a new album, imo. Some new material that they can then choose not to play in favour of the TC stalwarts...

As for what to expect from any new album, I think unless they're completely spineless idiots, it's reasonable to assume that CCP will be unleashed musically. And across TGF and The Turn, they have emphatically proven that they can bring the goods. They can still rock the fuck out. So straight away, it should be a massive step up from the stale BOP and wimpy SFBM.

The real question is, can Ed still produce something worthy of the Live name? He is clear as day the weak link of the group in terms of making new stuff that's actually any good. His solo output is generic Christian pop rock which is simply not good enough. Lyrically, he's been stuck in a rut for yeeeeaaaars, and at times throughout TFATM and Alive it's just downright embarrassing. See Parasite for a shining example. Even sidestepping the fact that it's possibly probably a song aimed at CCP, it's just horrendously basic and childlike. The only way he could explain it is if he came out and said he was just having a laugh with his kids and he let them write it. Seriously.

All this said, under some very specific conditions they could possibly make good stuff together. Let's not worry about it hitting the heights of the big four. What it would have to do is stand at least on par with The Turn. Which is a massive ask considering Ed's record since 1999.

But if CCP can be in charge and Ed can do as he's fucking told, it might work. He needs to try hard, really hard, to be a bit more like the old Ed. And maybe being back in amongst the guys, with a fire right up their arses, it could happen. Writing to CCP's music the vast majority of the time would be a good start. And CCP need veto power. Because Ed's proven he can't be trusted, basically. BOP, SFBM, Alive, SFBM, TFATM, SFBM, he's shown nothing for a long time that's worthy of Live and he's had the absolute run of the gaff. Meanwhile, CCP dropped The Turn. And soz (but not really), I know some of you will disagree, but The Turn is a Live album. And a fucking good one. The transcendent feel, depth, mystique, spirit and essence of Live is there for the first time since TDTH.

Tell ya where they should start. CT once said in an interview that they went back and listened to the old albums back to back to rediscover who they were as Live (before going on to release The Turn, of best album since TDTH fame). They should strap Ed down in a chair and do that. Maybe ten times over. They need to brainwash the bastard. See, Ed. You were amazing. Remember this? All this good stuff? Let's have a go at this kind of thing. Where we're not shit. Here's some new music we've written. Have a look, have a tinker, and maybe think about some words that don't involve how much you love Jesus.

tl;dr - Ed's the weak link and needs to step up if any new music has a chance of being good.

PS: If they're dropping gems, how about New City? Don't think I've ever asked for that before.

This post has been edited by Merica: Nov 18 2016, 7:55 am

[vivapokey]

tl;dr - Ed's the weak link and needs to step up if any new music has a chance of being good.
.

Its hard to disagree with all of that. But my fear I think goes a step further. In that, yes, to make it good Ed has to be brought up a few levels by CCP, but that can work both ways and he can bring CCP down. It'll have to be about compromise. In a perfect world, CCP run everything. But realistically, Ed is a person too with his own moral code, broken as it may be, his own desires, aspirations, dignity (I know, i know) and he'll have to stand up for himself and what he wants to bring. CCP will have to relent on some things, they already relented on letting him back in. So, the fear is that through compromise they'll just breed mediocrity in order to not rock the boat. I can already imagine given what we got with TGF and The Turn that they would have to work VERY hard to make an album now that's worse than SFBM or BOP. For all the doom and gloom I'm sprouting, realistically I know that whatever they do will be better than those. But that is a bar so low that beating it is hardly impressive.

So Ed is the weak link, but will he make CCP weaker as well?

[Wambangalang]

I'm a bit worried reading some of the reactions from fans on social media, bashing chris and praising the return of Ed and calling it the return of real Live, suggesting the Turn was shit. Maybe the casual fan really does want BOP and SFBM, maybe CCP know this and just decided they need the money and Ed has them all over a barrel financially or whatever, and they are just smiling through it for appearances and we end up with another ed solo album with the name live on it.

I hope not but now that the reunion is a reality that possibility is striking me as more realistic

[vivapokey]

A lot of reactions on social media would be pretty genuine, and a lot of just reactionary. We are creatures of habit. "Hey that's a thing I know, i like things I know!" It's why so many can't accept change, can't even accept a song not sounding just like they know it to sound on an album. So a lot of the times I don't even really think people factor in "hmm would this mean a possible return back to a lesser sound?" Even if they disliked SFBM. They're just excited by things they know and recognise and feel comfortable in nostalgia. South Park hit on it lately with their "member berries" thing.

Not saying this is all people, of course, but undeniably a lot do work this way. If Live had lost Ed directly after SS or TDTH and then made The Turn with Chris and then Ed came back...well then that's an interesting idea. Then you'd have the most recent memory in people's mind of Live with Ed being their best days and they don't have to factor in 16yrs of poor form in between.

[Merica]

Its hard to disagree with all of that. But my fear I think goes a step further. In that, yes, to make it good Ed has to be brought up a few levels by CCP, but that can work both ways and he can bring CCP down. It'll have to be about compromise. In a perfect world, CCP run everything. But realistically, Ed is a person too with his own moral code, broken as it may be, his own desires, aspirations, dignity (I know, i know) and he'll have to stand up for himself and what he wants to bring. CCP will have to relent on some things, they already relented on letting him back in. So, the fear is that through compromise they'll just breed mediocrity in order to not rock the boat. I can already imagine given what we got with TGF and The Turn that they would have to work VERY hard to make an album now that's worse than SFBM or BOP. For all the doom and gloom I'm sprouting, realistically I know that whatever they do will be better than those. But that is a bar so low that beating it is hardly impressive.

So Ed is the weak link, but will he make CCP weaker as well?

Yeah, Ed may well drag them down. Or be un-drag-uppable. I mean, considering the lyrics he's been writing since TDTH... it would be amazingly shocking if he just suddenly dropped an album of good material.

I'm a bit worried reading some of the reactions from fans on social media, bashing chris and praising the return of Ed and calling it the return of real Live, suggesting the Turn was shit. Maybe the casual fan really does want BOP and SFBM, maybe CCP know this and just decided they need the money and Ed has them all over a barrel financially or whatever, and they are just smiling through it for appearances and we end up with another ed solo album with the name live on it.

I hope not but now that the reunion is a reality that possibility is striking me as more realistic

Ugh. I mean, I really don't think this will happen. But if it does then you'd just have to lose all respect for CCP unfortunately.

[throwing_cheetahs]

I'm a bit worried reading some of the reactions from fans on social media, bashing chris and praising the return of Ed and calling it the return of real Live

Your worried, yet 99% of +Live+ fans worldwide are happy to have the original 4 members back together.

This post has been edited by throwing_cheetahs: Nov 19 2016, 6:35 am

[Hoodstock]

I'm a bit worried reading some of the reactions from fans on social media, bashing chris and praising the return of Ed and calling it the return of real Live, suggesting the Turn was shit.

Nothing to worry about at all.

My opinion- it was shit. Your opinion obviously differs. SFBM, IMO, was also shit. What do they both have in common? They're both in the past.

Just because Shinn was part of the band doesn't mean people have to like his work with them. Didn't hear all this support for Railio when they dumped him but Shinn is somehow different?

Two options at this point. Be optimistic about the future or be pessimistic about it. Reality will hit either way when we see what they put out.

[Merica]

Just because Shinn was part of the band doesn't mean people have to like his work with them. Didn't hear all this support for Railio when they dumped him but Shinn is somehow different?

Surely the answer is yes!? We're not comparing a band's singer and songwriter with a hired hand keyboard player are we?

[Hoodstock]

Surely the answer is yes!? We're not comparing a band's singer and songwriter with a hired hand keyboard player are we?

You're right. Shinn had a bigger impact so if you didn't like him and his impact your preference would probably be to keep Ralio over Shinn.

It's like Trump. He has a following and he has people who despise him. Now he is our leader. In Live / Shinn philosophy that now would mean that everyone MUST love him because he leads the band .... I mean country.

Shinn fans remind me in a way of Trump supporters. You can't force people to respect or love something they dislike. Both Trump and Shinn supporters fail to see why anyone would dislike their man. To them Shinn was "Make Live Great Again".

They are very different things and situations but the philosophy of their supporters is the same.

This post has been edited by Hoodstock: Nov 19 2016, 10:03 am

[SJN1279]

You're right. Shinn had a bigger impact so if you didn't like him and his impact your preference would probably be to keep Ralio over Shinn.

It's like Trump. He has a following and he has people who despise him. Now he is our leader. In Live / Shinn philosophy that now would mean that everyone MUST love him because he leads the band .... I mean country.

Shinn fans remind me in a way of Trump supporters. You can't force people to respect or love something they dislike. Both Trump and Shinn supporters fail to see why anyone would dislike their man. To them Shinn was "Make Live Great Again".

They are very different things and situations but the philosophy of their supporters is the same.

Very good analogy.