Ed Kowalczyk Opens Up About His Ugly Split With Live, Rolling Stone Options

[Bremang]

Also, Shinn sounds better in concert than on recordings for some reason.

[StoodUpForLive]

Fact of the matter is Shinn is not the same level of vocalist Ed was when we all fell in love with Live but neither is Ed of today. He sounds like a completely different singer and has turned off most original Live fans which is why the fan base has dwindled down to almost nothing.

At the end of the day, Ed does not own the rights to Live and the rest of the guys do so they can do just about anything they want with it. He may not do the original Live songs justice, but I'm definitely open to what they have to offer moving forward with new songs and records. It's pretty sad what Ed has become and he should never be allowed to be the front man and represent Live ever again.

I agree with you that new Live material w Shinn should be given a chance. It's not his fault that CCP can't get along w Ed. At the same time, to me anyway, Throwing Copper and a few other albums to a lesser degree had some magic to them that can't be recreated. I'd rather see only the original lineup, or only Ed perform Throwing Copper. Anything else, to me, would be like me screaming someone else's name while my girlfriend and I are going at it. Just too awkward, too many memories.

Shinn has some shoes to fill and I sincerely hope the new material sounds good, and it should because CCCP have a ton of talent, and with Jerry Harrison producing maybe there's some magic left. I'm a music fan first and foremost so I'm hoping for a good product.

In the end I wish them all the best. Most of us don't know the whole story and even those who do know the full story are biased one way or the other. I'm sure mistakes were made on both sides, and I suspect Ed may hold more blame. It's unlikely we will ever see a reunion, but if we do I would welcome it, even if it was just for a season.

Finally, Ed's voice is not what it used to be, but as a musician and singer I know that the passion he put into his performances all those years -- performances that we all benefited from -- took its toll on him. Yes, he and CCP made money, yes he stoked his own ego w each new record and sold out stadium but we were the beneficiaries of some epic stuff, and his voice paid the price. I give him credit.

At the same time, CCP are legends in their own right. They leave me in awe. I will always buy their stuff. I will always buy Ed's stuff. Personal politics aside.

This post has been edited by StoodUpForLive: Dec 16 2013, 9:48 pm

[zmanpga]

Chris Shinn is a good guy, wonderful personality, great pipes and down to earth, drug me on stage with him in York, when White Discussion came on

[Stood Up For Live]

Oh no...my user name has been duplicated! I guess I should feel flattered?
DJ

[turningstones]

But before the joy, there was the pain of parting ways with your longtime friends in a very acrimonious way. You've never really talked about it publicly before. Why?
I avoided it, not because I didn't want to talk about it, but because I felt like it was such a distraction. This was supposed to be a new, bright moment in my career, and I wanted people to focus on that.

You guys were like a band of brothers – the pride of York, Pennsylvania. When did all the trouble start? After 20-something years, it was time for a rest, and we all agreed to it. We agreed on a two-year hiatus in 2009: we'd wind Live down, the whole machine, and everybody would go do their thing. We played the last show that summer in Long Island, then there was this nightmare of legal stuff that started pretty much immediately. For me, it absolutely was a natural progression [that I would want to pursue solo projects], but there was this unforeseen, incredible fallout that those guys generated against me that was really shocking.

What was the gist of that first lawsuit?
They sued me [over] this years-old publishing agreement that we had totally agreed to already. All of a sudden there was this loophole or this problem with it. I'd always been the writer, always wrote the lyrics, melodies and most of the music in Live, and I wanted to have my own publishing company and not a joint one. I wanted to move on and start another aspect of my recording career with the solo records, and they totally agreed to it back in 2006. So they dredged this thing up and said they were misled, which is totally untrue. It was practically out of the statutes of limitations, from what I was told. And it was just totally malicious. They just threw it at me to knock me down around the release of [Alive], which increased the shock and awe of it. I'd never been sued before in my life.

At this point you were still a member of Live – you'd planned to reunite with the band after doing the solo record. Why would they want to threaten the future of the band?
I think it was just anger that I was going to go and do something without them. It's really hard for me to say what their motivations were, or are. I have been completely dumbfounded by their activities and actions over the last four years. I was just trying to move forward and find that energy, that passion again. At the same time that all of this was happening, I was having some of the best shows of my career. One of the first things I did was sing with the Metropole Orchestra in Holland. I was reconnecting with the fans in this amazing, new, intimate and powerful way. I was writing great music. So, for me, it was just weird. I was having this incredible renaissance of joy in what I was doing, but at the same time, there was the contrast of literal legal siege being brought to my doorstep. They had this malicious program of dropping these legal bombs on me when my [first solo] record came out, on my birthday, on Christmas Eve. Every day I had to compartmentalize the fact that these guys who called themselves my friends for most of my life weren't.

The second lawsuit was over trademark infringement: they didn't want you to say that you were "of" the band Live. [Kowalczyk is now referred to as "formerly of Live."
It's been a problem coming as a solo artist after being known as [the singer with] Live for so long, and having to inform the public and, at the same time, abide by these agreements that I've made. It just seems silly to me, and unnecessary.


At what point did you realize that you were going to have to leave the band?
[After the first lawsuit], when things had risen to such a stupid level. It's kind of hard, if not impossible, to come back from a breach of trust that a lawsuit represents.

Did you find it hard to concentrate on writing new music with all of this going on?
In some weird, crazy way that life works, I feel that there's a depth with The Flood and the Mercy that wouldn't be there [if not for the strife]. It's really lemonade from lemons. I just kept trying to use it as grist for the mill. And it made the record and made my shows better. I just used the gifts that I had been given to provide this catharsis for myself, to get through things and to see the bright side, and, at the same time, not deny the fact that I was going through some really shitty stuff.

I missed this interview. Interesting reply from Ed. He was awful quiet the whole time until this piece was published. The contract stuff seems like a gray area on details, but that was the big lawsuit dealing with financial wrong doings. If it was such what Ed is saying here, why would the LIVE legal team come after Ed and whomever else so hard. I would think the band business would have to get that to stop or whatever.
There had to be something there and from what i see now is settled. Ed is doing way more touring now than ever before. He must have something in the settlement which is making him tour more, idk? Perhaps he owes something on those gray area contracts. Just a shot in the dark.

On the 'of live' thing, he's def changed course there and no longer doing it. Seems that settling on that was def with CCP's. The other is anyone's guess.

[SJN1279]

I missed this interview. Interesting reply from Ed. He was awful quiet the whole time until this piece was published. The contract stuff seems like a gray area on details, but that was the big lawsuit dealing with financial wrong doings. If it was such what Ed is saying here, why would the LIVE legal team come after Ed and whomever else so hard. I would think the band business would have to get that to stop or whatever.
There had to be something there and from what i see now is settled. Ed is doing way more touring now than ever before. He must have something in the settlement which is making him tour more, idk? Perhaps he owes something on those gray area contracts. Just a shot in the dark.

On the 'of live' thing, he's def changed course there and no longer doing it. Seems that settling on that was def with CCP's. The other is anyone's guess.

-He was quiet because he was involved with a lawsuit.

-The lawsuit was settled. I tend to believe CCP did not achieve all they had hoped for in the lawsuit, because there was a ton of crowing during the lawsuit, but no crowing afterwards(by them or their fans).

-Ed is actually filling venues easier since he made the switch to formerly of Live. I guess when he was being billed as of Live, people figured they could skip his solo shows and catch the act when Live got to town. That is no longer the case.

-Ed is doing more touring now, because he can as a solo act. CCP are the ones who didn't like extensive touring.

[SinfulEyes]

-Ed is doing more touring now, because he can as a solo act. CCP are the ones who didn't like extensive touring.

To be honest Ed does too many shows. Watching him with Live during the later years and perform nowadays is like eating stale Saltines.

[turningstones]

-He was quiet because he was involved with a lawsuit.

-The lawsuit was settled. I tend to believe CCP did not achieve all they had hoped for in the lawsuit, because there was a ton of crowing during the lawsuit, but no crowing afterwards(by them or their fans).

-Ed is actually filling venues easier since he made the switch to formerly of Live. I guess when he was being billed as of Live, people figured they could skip his solo shows and catch the act when Live got to town. That is no longer the case.

-Ed is doing more touring now, because he can as a solo act. CCP are the ones who didn't like extensive touring.

with Taylor pointing to questionable lead-singer behaviour:
demands for a $100,000 'lead singer bonus' to play a European festival, and changing the band's publishing deal to make him sole signatory.

I think that is the root of the issue with the first suit. Sole signatory means he somehow got his signature on the document when the other 3 didn't...... shady, if not moreso in the white collar crime definition

He's filling halls in Europe and Australia you mean? If you call 200 seat halls in the US filled then I can't dispute the word filled, but scaled down a lot yes. No the of LIVE thing was a def copyright infringement. The change was definately due to mis billing. THere was no confusion around when Live announced Chris as the singer and then toured. No way no how. I think this is your interpretation of something.

[Tips]

As far as I'm concerned, I started seeing a big change with Ed during the V era. His ego took over after TDTH for some reason. I remember the first time it hit me. They were playing a music station in Montreal and the interviewer asked how V came about and Ed said something along the lines of "I'm not the kind of person to isolate myself in the desert to write music. I need the energy of the road" and the interviewer said "You told me the exact opposite last time. I started feeling like Ed was playing a game.

Then the Overcome video and the lame "I'm going to film myself near the ruins and sing Overcome a capella with a candle and a tear in my eye". The whole thing just made my stomach turn. I didn't believe the authenticity of it. What I saw there was an ego taking advantage of a situation to showcase himself. Maybe I'm wrong, but that's how it felt to me.

Then then focus turned to Ed and the guys became a backing band. Birds of Pray was the first sign of this. The music was boring at best and the lyrics were bad and unsubtle. I was disappointed in the band I had loved for the past 10 years from Four Songs to Distance to Here. I liked V but it wasn't Live. Birds of Pray really wasn't Live. Then I learned that Ed was writing by himself except one or two songs. Again, the Run Away video where he appears by himself with Shelby Lynn. It just felt wrong.


When SFBM was announced, I was hoping to find Live again. When I heard the first "la da di da" from The River I knew this meant the end. The band I had loved was no more. I was OK with that, it happens. It's a shame, but it happens.

Then the band broke up and Ed released Alive. I gave it a listen and could only hear the logical continuity of BOP and SFBM. That confirmed to me that the band was gone way before they broke up. Chad Taylor said somewhere that they became sort of Ed's backing band. That pretty much sums it up. Because even before the whole legal battle commenced, I felt like Ed took over and his ego was casting a cloud on a once great band. The music they were coming up with was proof of that.

When they sued him, I wasn't surprised of the supposed lead singer bonus and publishing deal. I was saddened.

I didn't really enjoy The Gracious Few. But I was happy that three of the most talented musicians out there today were making more enjoyable music. During that time, Ed was promoting his solo stuff and I didn't like how he tried to act as if Live never ended. I understand that he wanted to focus on the positive. But we had 3/4 of a band publicly saying things about him that needed clearing up for the fans.

When Chris joined and they started playing show, I felt like they were Live again. There was an energy that was missing before. The whole band seemed to enjoy themselves again. That was refreshing. Then they released The Turn and finally I found the band I had love in my youth. The message was conveyed differently (Chris and Ed are different lyricists) but the music, the positive energy, it's all there.

As for Ed, after so many years and after everything was settled, I think it's fine he give his side of the story. But the whole "And they're not being real clear about who's in it anymore. They obfuscate that it's not the real band. They don't say that it's not the original [lineup]. They just kind of go out and surprise people, and it's really sort of lame." is in itself lame. Come on, most if not all people who buy tickets to see Live in concert knows they changed frontman. That's just a dig for the sake of taking a jab at them. It's all very classless.

[ThrowgnCpr]

As far as I'm concerned, I started seeing a big change with Ed during the V era. His ego took over after TDTH for some reason. I remember the first time it hit me. They were playing a music station in Montreal and the interviewer asked how V came about and Ed said something along the lines of "I'm not the kind of person to isolate myself in the desert to write music. I need the energy of the road" and the interviewer said "You told me the exact opposite last time. I started feeling like Ed was playing a game.

Then the Overcome video and the lame "I'm going to film myself near the ruins and sing Overcome a capella with a candle and a tear in my eye". The whole thing just made my stomach turn. I didn't believe the authenticity of it. What I saw there was an ego taking advantage of a situation to showcase himself. Maybe I'm wrong, but that's how it felt to me.

Then then focus turned to Ed and the guys became a backing band. Birds of Pray was the first sign of this. The music was boring at best and the lyrics were bad and unsubtle. I was disappointed in the band I had loved for the past 10 years from Four Songs to Distance to Here. I liked V but it wasn't Live. Birds of Pray really wasn't Live. Then I learned that Ed was writing by himself except one or two songs. Again, the Run Away video where he appears by himself with Shelby Lynn. It just felt wrong.
When SFBM was announced, I was hoping to find Live again. When I heard the first "la da di da" from The River I knew this meant the end. The band I had loved was no more. I was OK with that, it happens. It's a shame, but it happens.

Then the band broke up and Ed released Alive. I gave it a listen and could only hear the logical continuity of BOP and SFBM. That confirmed to me that the band was gone way before they broke up. Chad Taylor said somewhere that they became sort of Ed's backing band. That pretty much sums it up. Because even before the whole legal battle commenced, I felt like Ed took over and his ego was casting a cloud on a once great band. The music they were coming up with was proof of that.

When they sued him, I wasn't surprised of the supposed lead singer bonus and publishing deal. I was saddened.

I didn't really enjoy The Gracious Few. But I was happy that three of the most talented musicians out there today were making more enjoyable music. During that time, Ed was promoting his solo stuff and I didn't like how he tried to act as if Live never ended. I understand that he wanted to focus on the positive. But we had 3/4 of a band publicly saying things about him that needed clearing up for the fans.

When Chris joined and they started playing show, I felt like they were Live again. There was an energy that was missing before. The whole band seemed to enjoy themselves again. That was refreshing. Then they released The Turn and finally I found the band I had love in my youth. The message was conveyed differently (Chris and Ed are different lyricists) but the music, the positive energy, it's all there.

As for Ed, after so many years and after everything was settled, I think it's fine he give his side of the story. But the whole "And they're not being real clear about who's in it anymore. They obfuscate that it's not the real band. They don't say that it's not the original [lineup]. They just kind of go out and surprise people, and it's really sort of lame." is in itself lame. Come on, most if not all people who buy tickets to see Live in concert knows they changed frontman. That's just a dig for the sake of taking a jab at them. It's all very classless.

perfectly stated.

[Tips]

Sorry for the typos though!

[jclive]

It's all very classless.

From where I sit, yes, it has all been very classless. It's a shame that the fans (I) had to hear about so much dirty laundry that should have been kept in private. It's skewed my thoughts of each member. But it was their choice to air it, and mine to read it.

I'm in 100% agreement with Chad from that article where he says that he wants Ed to have the solo career he should have had earlier, and wants the others to continue with Live in the way they always wanted to. I can imagine the strength and health of the Live community would be far different today had this been the extent of what was aired in public about the hiatus and eventual breakup.

[Tips]

From where I sit, yes, it has all been very classless. It's a shame that the fans (I) had to hear about so much dirty laundry that should have been kept in private. It's skewed my thoughts of each member. But it was their choice to air it, and mine to read it.

I'm in 100% agreement with Chad from that article where he says that he wants Ed to have the solo career he should have had earlier, and wants the others to continue with Live in the way they always wanted to. I can imagine the strength and health of the Live community would be far different today had this been the extent of what was aired in public about the hiatus and eventual breakup.

Oh absolutely! Instead of Birds of Pray and Songs From Black Mountain, we might have had all of what Chris did in the 2000 (Everything is Energy, his eponymous record and The Turn) under the Live banner and I do think they would have kept surfing on success.

Live are three super talented musicians that need a certain type of frontman/songwriter who is willing to act as part of a band to make the magic happen. Ed was like that in the 90's and not in the 2000's. Chris is like that now and the magic is back. And if Ed is happy with the music he makes on his own, then good for him. I wish him well. But I've never been an Ed Kowalczyk fan. I was a Live fan. And now Live is back.

[jclive]

Oh absolutely! Instead of Birds of Pray and Songs From Black Mountain, we might have had all of what Chris did in the 2000 (Everything is Energy, his eponymous record and The Turn) under the Live banner and I do think they would have kept surfing on success.

Live are three super talented musicians that need a certain type of frontman/songwriter who is willing to act as part of a band to make the magic happen. Ed was like that in the 90's and not in the 2000's. Chris is like that now and the magic is back. And if Ed is happy with the music he makes on his own, then good for him. I wish him well. But I've never been an Ed Kowalczyk fan. I was a Live fan. And now Live is back.

Good perspective. I wasn't and Ed fan before the split. I was a Live fan! Then when they split, I became and Ed fan. And I remained a Live fan too. Hard to grasp how some cant see it as being that simple.

[Tips]

Good perspective. I wasn't and Ed fan before the split. I was a Live fan! Then when they split, I became and Ed fan. And I remained a Live fan too. Hard to grasp how some cant see it as being that simple.

Indeed! The music is there to be appreciated or not. I don't like what Ed does since 2000 and you do. I like Live and you do too.

In the end, it's all good!