Ed's spirituality, And yours. Options

[Godiva]

I know I'm a nOOb, but this issue is one of the reasons I remain at least somewhat interested in Live's music and visionary nature... and I was wondering what the general attitude of posters on this board is regarding such matters.

I don't know a whole lot about what Ed subscribes to, I am more of an atheist-leaning agnostic. However, I find Ed's outlook on life refreshing... if one is to be a theist, then his kind of theism is the kind I can relate to and the kind I think can actually do some good in the world.

What about you guys? Have Live's songs connected with your spirit? Influenced your belief? What are your tendencies in things of a metaphysical nature?

I left Christianity in my early years of college. I found Live's older music extremely helpful to me during that time in my life (even though no one was playing those songs on the radio anymore).

[FishOutaWater]

I really get a strong spiritual message from many of Ed's lyrics. I could discuss that for hours.

You mentioned "I Alone" so I thought I'd respond with something based on a post that I made on the friendsoflive.com board some months ago. It has to do with a philosophical interpretation of the song.

I listened to an interview with Ed once in which he discussed I Alone and he mentioned that he was reading alot of Krishnamurti at the time and the lyric "and the greatest of teachers won't hesitate to leave you there, by yourself, chained to fate" pertains to the fact that you must investigate and discover spirituality for yourself and not just rely on the "truths" told to you by others such as so-called religious leaders. The lyrics to I Alone always challenged me because they relate in large part to the concept that I just described, but I always thought that the lyrics "I Alone love you" was simply saying that I alone love you -- that is -- I am the only one that loves you. I always viewed that passionately delivered lyric to be a love seronade to someone and it resonated with me as an emotional line that someone would deliver to a girlfriend or something.

Here is a quote from Jiddu Krishnamurti:

"Aloneness Is Not Loneliness

Though we are all human beings, we have built walls between ourselves and our neighbors through nationalism, through race, caste, and class—which again breeds isolation, loneliness.

Now a mind that is caught in loneliness, in this state of isolation, can never possibly understand what religion is. It can believe, it can have certain theories, concepts, formulas, it can try to identify itself with that which it calls God; but religion, it seems to me, has nothing whatsoever to do with any belief, with any priest, with any church or so-called sacred book. The state of the religious mind can be understood only when we begin to understand what beauty is; and the understanding of beauty must be approached through total aloneness. Only when the mind is completely alone can it know what is beauty, and not in any other state.

Aloneness is obviously not isolation, and it is not uniqueness. To be unique is merely to be exceptional in some way, whereas to be completely alone demands extraordinary sensitivity, intelligence, understanding. To be completely alone implies that the mind is free of every kind of influence and is therefore uncontaminated by society; and it must be alone to understand what is religion—which is to find out for oneself whether there is something immortal, beyond time.

The Book of Life - December 2"

And here is another one:
"Only in Aloneness Is There Innocence

Most of us are never alone. You may withdraw into the mountains and live as a recluse, but when you are physically by yourself, you will have with you all your ideas, your experiences, your traditions, your knowledge of what has been. The Christian monk in a monastery cell is not alone; he is with his conceptual Jesus, with his theology, with the beliefs and dogmas of his particular conditioning. Similarly, the sannyasi in India who withdraws from the world and lives in isolation is not alone, for he too lives with his memories.

I am talking of an aloneness in which the mind is totally free from the past, and only such a mind is virtuous, for only in this aloneness is there innocence. Perhaps you will say, "That is too much to ask. One cannot live like that in this chaotic world, where one has to go to the office every day, earn a livelihood, bear children, endure the nagging of one's wife or husband, and all the rest of it." But I think what is being said is directly related to everyday life and action; otherwise, it has no value at all. You see, out of this aloneness comes a virtue which is virile and which brings an extraordinary sense of purity and gentleness. It doesn't matter if one makes mistakes; that is of very little importance. What matters is to have this feeling of being completely alone, uncontaminated, for it is only such a mind that can know or be aware of that which is beyond the word, beyond the name, beyond all the projections of imagination.

The Book of Life - December 4"


In view of the fact that Ed was influence by Krishnamurti at the time, I think the lyric "I Alone" is not about what I used to think it was about at all! If you do a Google search on some of Krishnamurti's writings you will see that the concept of I Alone means to Krishnamurti, as described in the quote above something like this: "To be completely alone implies that the mind is free of every kind of influence and is therefore uncontaminated by society; and it must be alone to understand what is religion—which is to find out for oneself whether there is something immortal, beyond time." One of Krishnamurti's principles is that the only way to reach spiritual liberation and enlightenment is to first free one's self entirely from the thousands of years of bias and belief and ethnocentricity and the dogma of others, etc. Once you are "Alone" without those influences, then you can truly love. Then you can truly find "religion". I Alone doesn't just mean "just me - I'm the one that loves you" or "I'm physically alone". It is much more profound.

In light of that, I think one might hear that song completely differently and read the lyrics in a new light. And it is a million times more powerful than just professing your love for a girl.

[Staycie]

I really get a strong spiritual message from many of Ed's lyrics. I could discuss that for hours.

You mentioned "I Alone" so I thought I'd respond with something based on a post that I made on the friendsoflive.com board some months ago. It has to do with a philosophical interpretation of the song.

I listened to an interview with Ed once in which he discussed I Alone and he mentioned that he was reading alot of Krishnamurti at the time and the lyric "and the greatest of teachers won't hesitate to leave you there, by yourself, chained to fate" pertains to the fact that you must investigate and discover spirituality for yourself and not just rely on the "truths" told to you by others such as so-called religious leaders. The lyrics to I Alone always challenged me because they relate in large part to the concept that I just described, but I always thought that the lyrics "I Alone love you" was simply saying that I alone love you -- that is -- I am the only one that loves you. I always viewed that passionately delivered lyric to be a love seronade to someone and it resonated with me as an emotional line that someone would deliver to a girlfriend or something.

Here is a quote from Jiddu Krishnamurti:

"Aloneness Is Not Loneliness

Though we are all human beings, we have built walls between ourselves and our neighbors through nationalism, through race, caste, and class—which again breeds isolation, loneliness.

Now a mind that is caught in loneliness, in this state of isolation, can never possibly understand what religion is. It can believe, it can have certain theories, concepts, formulas, it can try to identify itself with that which it calls God; but religion, it seems to me, has nothing whatsoever to do with any belief, with any priest, with any church or so-called sacred book. The state of the religious mind can be understood only when we begin to understand what beauty is; and the understanding of beauty must be approached through total aloneness. Only when the mind is completely alone can it know what is beauty, and not in any other state.

Aloneness is obviously not isolation, and it is not uniqueness. To be unique is merely to be exceptional in some way, whereas to be completely alone demands extraordinary sensitivity, intelligence, understanding. To be completely alone implies that the mind is free of every kind of influence and is therefore uncontaminated by society; and it must be alone to understand what is religion—which is to find out for oneself whether there is something immortal, beyond time.

The Book of Life - December 2"

And here is another one:
"Only in Aloneness Is There Innocence

Most of us are never alone. You may withdraw into the mountains and live as a recluse, but when you are physically by yourself, you will have with you all your ideas, your experiences, your traditions, your knowledge of what has been. The Christian monk in a monastery cell is not alone; he is with his conceptual Jesus, with his theology, with the beliefs and dogmas of his particular conditioning. Similarly, the sannyasi in India who withdraws from the world and lives in isolation is not alone, for he too lives with his memories.

I am talking of an aloneness in which the mind is totally free from the past, and only such a mind is virtuous, for only in this aloneness is there innocence. Perhaps you will say, "That is too much to ask. One cannot live like that in this chaotic world, where one has to go to the office every day, earn a livelihood, bear children, endure the nagging of one's wife or husband, and all the rest of it." But I think what is being said is directly related to everyday life and action; otherwise, it has no value at all. You see, out of this aloneness comes a virtue which is virile and which brings an extraordinary sense of purity and gentleness. It doesn't matter if one makes mistakes; that is of very little importance. What matters is to have this feeling of being completely alone, uncontaminated, for it is only such a mind that can know or be aware of that which is beyond the word, beyond the name, beyond all the projections of imagination.

The Book of Life - December 4"
In view of the fact that Ed was influence by Krishnamurti at the time, I think the lyric "I Alone" is not about what I used to think it was about at all! If you do a Google search on some of Krishnamurti's writings you will see that the concept of I Alone means to Krishnamurti, as described in the quote above something like this: "To be completely alone implies that the mind is free of every kind of influence and is therefore uncontaminated by society; and it must be alone to understand what is religion—which is to find out for oneself whether there is something immortal, beyond time." One of Krishnamurti's principles is that the only way to reach spiritual liberation and enlightenment is to first free one's self entirely from the thousands of years of bias and belief and ethnocentricity and the dogma of others, etc. Once you are "Alone" without those influences, then you can truly love. Then you can truly find "religion". I Alone doesn't just mean "just me - I'm the one that loves you" or "I'm physically alone". It is much more profound.

In light of that, I think one might hear that song completely differently and read the lyrics in a new light. And it is a million times more powerful than just professing your love for a girl.

this makes me want to know more....................... i'm looking up Krishnamurti's principles right now..............

This post has been edited by Staycie: Jun 1 2006, 11:12 pm