A single for rock radio... Options

[Whiskey]

... the marketing of this album truly baffles me. (longtime lurker, first time poster, btw).

I think this album is actually a lot better than I expected it to be after hearing The River and Mystery. Album sales that don't even get the disc into the top 50 proves that Epic didn't know what they were doing.

There are five songs on this album that I think are extremely good. Show, Sofia, Where do we go from here, Home, , and the best song LIVE has done in years: Night of Nights.

Release one of these as a single to rock radio - the same stations that provided LIVE with a career in the first place and built up their fanbase. This whole attempt to angle at adult contemporary stations is silly because songs like The River, and Heaven off of BOP aren't SO good that they are going to bring in new fans. They might not even inspire people to buy albums.

But if you realease a song that rock radio will play - I think of the songs that I mentioned, all but Home would get airplay on rock radio. It'll remind longtime fans that the band has a new album out (becasue it hasn't been promoted, at all) - and will help sales.

Not that sales are an all-important - but when we start talking about opening week sales of 20,000 or whatever it is, that's when labels start considering major acts to have gone bust, and it becomes more difficult to release albums... and not to long after that you see the band performing at County Fairs and whatnot.

And we all know this is far too good of a band to let that happen...

Random things to introduce myself to the board:

Absolutely love the version of Supernatural from unplugged, but if you've never heard the Vic Chesnutt original, you need to download it today. Amazing.

Favorite songs from each album:

MJ: Beauty of Grey
TC: Pillar of Davidson
SS: Lakini's Juice
TDTH: Where Fishes Go or The Distance
V: Overcome
BOP: Rivertown/Like I do
AWAKE: We Deal in Dreams
SFBM: Night of Nights

Live is my 2nd favorite band of all time, just behind Pearl Jam...

[edstipe]

... the marketing of this album truly baffles me. (longtime lurker, first time poster, btw).

I think this album is actually a lot better than I expected it to be after hearing The River and Mystery. Album sales that don't even get the disc into the top 50 proves that Epic didn't know what they were doing.

There are five songs on this album that I think are extremely good. Show, Sofia, Where do we go from here, Home, , and the best song LIVE has done in years: Night of Nights.

Release one of these as a single to rock radio - the same stations that provided LIVE with a career in the first place and built up their fanbase. This whole attempt to angle at adult contemporary stations is silly because songs like The River, and Heaven off of BOP aren't SO good that they are going to bring in new fans. They might not even inspire people to buy albums.

But if you realease a song that rock radio will play - I think of the songs that I mentioned, all but Home would get airplay on rock radio. It'll remind longtime fans that the band has a new album out (becasue it hasn't been promoted, at all) - and will help sales.

Not that sales are an all-important - but when we start talking about opening week sales of 20,000 or whatever it is, that's when labels start considering major acts to have gone bust, and it becomes more difficult to release albums... and not to long after that you see the band performing at County Fairs and whatnot.

And we all know this is far too good of a band to let that happen...

Random things to introduce myself to the board:

Absolutely love the version of Supernatural from unplugged, but if you've never heard the Vic Chesnutt original, you need to download it today. Amazing.

Favorite songs from each album:

MJ: Beauty of Grey
TC: Pillar of Davidson
SS: Lakini's Juice
TDTH: Where Fishes Go or The Distance
V: Overcome
BOP: Rivertown/Like I do
AWAKE: We Deal in Dreams
SFBM: Night of Nights

Live is my 2nd favorite band of all time, just behind Pearl Jam...

Great post, and I do agree on some accounts, especially about the marketing for this album being shitty, at best.

However, I disagree that trying to rediscover a niche in the rock radio market is the way to go with SFBM. I feel this way for a few reasons.

Firstly, SFBM simply is NOT a rock album, it is a pop album. Although there are a few songs on the record that have some slight rock edges to them (Sofia and Show, mainly), there isn't enough to promote the record to rock fans and try to sell it as a rock album. If that were to happen, the rock fans who went out and bought SFBM expecting a good rock record would walk away disappointed and ultimately turned off to the band as a whole.

Secondly, and more importantly, today's "rock radio" is nothing like what it was when Live was being played on it. In fact, the "rock" stations that used to play Live have largely stopped playing even their older stuff, while the "adult contemporary" stations that now exist are the only ones who play any of Live's stuff, new or old. Simply put, the adult contemporary stations are not only the most logical place for the band to be pushing their music, but the only place left to do so.

A few other points to respond to yours:

... and not to long after that you see the band performing at County Fairs and whatnot.

I actually saw Live performing at the L.A. County Fair a couple years ago.

Live is my 2nd favorite band of all time, just behind Pearl Jam...

Pearl Jam fucking rules.

[SJN1279]

Two very good posts. I was one of the most vocal against releasing Like I Do from Birds of Pray as a single. This was because Heaven because of a great push from Geffen was getting strong airplay in the Hot A/C format and I felt since Simple Creed didn't do great on rock radio that Live was finished in the market.

However, since Epic couldn't get The River into rotation and have struggled to find airplay for Mystery(even though it was played on the highest rated show of the year) they need to refocus their efforts to where Live started. Releasing Night of Nights would be a bold move for Live and label and it was one that should be done this summer to coincide with the upcoming tour.

Epic has shown no commitment in pushing Live's singles, but maybe rock radio would embrace Live once again. Its a smaller format and Night of Nights fits it perfectly. It also is a very catchy and classic rock song. I think it would do well.

[seriakiLLa]

Yup, all hope for good sales isn't lost yet. Release a better single and who knows, they just might break into the ranks.

[ShowOwnMet]

Epic has shown no commitment in pushing Live's singles, but maybe rock radio would embrace Live once again. Its a smaller format and Night of Nights fits it perfectly. It also is a very catchy and classic rock song. I think it would do well.

Quoted for truth.

[WaiterAtCliftons]

They had their chance to get back on "rock" radio if they would've released "Like I Do" as a single off BoP. They don't give a shit about being on rock radio anymore. It's all about pop rock now as much as I love them...thats what they are a pop rock band.

[SJN1279]

They had their chance to get back on "rock" radio if they would've released "Like I Do" as a single off BoP. They don't give a shit about being on rock radio anymore. It's all about pop rock now as much as I love them...thats what they are a pop rock band.

The reason they left rock radio was because rock/alternative radio rejected Simple Creed. It got airplay, but it wasn't the hit The Dolphin's Cry was. Rock radio also mostly rejected Heaven and totally shunned We Deal in Dreams. Heaven was a hit in the Hot A/C format and Run Away hit the top 20. So it made sense for Live to continue in that format for this album.

However, since Epic didn't get the singles the airplay they deserved, it couldn't hurt to try to release a new single exclusively to the rock format. I think Night of Nights could work. It just fits in my opinion.

[WaiterAtCliftons]

Yeah I could see "Night of Nights" maybe working. But it'd be a tough sell. It's definately the only one that would come close to getting back on rock radio.

This is 1057 the X's playlist. And I really couldn't see anything from SFBM able to fit between those songs.

edit:: Just realized either the X isn't playing new shit or its an old list...either way its a sample of what's on these days.

So Cold - Breaking Benjamin
Just Like You - 3 Days Grace
Cold - Crossfade
Getting Away With Murder - Papa Roach
Duality - Slipknot
Let Me Out - Future Leaders of the World
Breaking the Habit - Linkin Park
Ain't Comin Home - Silvertide
Alive - Kenny Wayne Shepherd
Vitamin R - Chevelle
Falls to Pieces - Velvet Revovler
Blue - A Perfect Circle
American Idiot - Green Day
Wake Up (Make a Move) - Lost Prophets
Open Your Eyes - Alter Bridge
Personal Jesus - Marilyn Manson
Bring Me Down - Pillar
Pain - Jimmy Eat World
Because of You - Nickelback
I'm In Love With Your Mother - Foggy Taint
Vertigo - U2
Breakdown - Instruction
Touche - Godsmack
Same Direction - Hoobastank
The Truth - Nonpoint
Nobody - Skindred
Time of Year - 8 Days Gone
Love and War - Drowning Pool
Counting the Days - Collective Soul
We're All to Blame - Sum 41
Take it Away - The Used
The End of Heartache - Killswitch Engage
A Favor House Atlantic - Coheed and Cambria
Word Up - Korn
Face to Face - Sevendust
Down - Candiria
Open Wounds - Skillet
Ugly - The Exies

This post has been edited by WaiterAtCliftons: Jun 14 2006, 4:12 pm

[sandkind]

i agree, don't see anything that would fit rock radio

[NectarDan]

The reason they left rock radio was because rock/alternative radio rejected Simple Creed. It got airplay, but it wasn't the hit The Dolphin's Cry was. Rock radio also mostly rejected Heaven and totally shunned We Deal in Dreams. Heaven was a hit in the Hot A/C format and Run Away hit the top 20. So it made sense for Live to continue in that format for this album.

I wouldn't say that Simple Creed was "rejected" by rock/alternative radio. It charted very well, even higher then their 2 previous singles before that (Run To The Water and TSUFL). Live should have released "Like I Do" as their first single off of BOP. By releasing "Heaven", they pretty much killed themselves in the rock/alternative formats.

However, since Epic didn't get the singles the airplay they deserved, it couldn't hurt to try to release a new single exclusively to the rock format.

I don't think Epic is to blame. I just think the public isn't really liking the singles that were put out. Small bands get played on radio all the time without a label behind them to "push" the songs. If the single is good and people like it, then they will continue to request it and it will get added to more and more stations; if the single is subpar and people don't like it, they won't request it all, and it will quickly fall off radio playists (or not get added at all). As for a new single in the rock format, I'm pretty sure there's no chance of that happening. Epic is done with this album. They have lost too much money on the album already. I don't see them sinking more money into releasing a new single that most likely won't even get added to stations.

[jonesy]

^Exactly!
Simple Creed did ok,I still hear it on the radio today. V lost it's momentum when they released Overcome,it should of been Deep Enough. That is the first very bad move that was made. V died in the ass after that after a pretty strong start here.
Then BOP,why oh why Like I Do wasn't released is almost a bigger mystery than why Dean Jones was omitted from the one day squad in the 90s. All the talk before the album was how Live were going back to there roots,and they promoting this album as rocking so hard! So what do they do, release heaven?? Alright,heaven did well on the single charts here for the teeny bopper audience,but teeny boppers don't buy albums. Then they follow up with Sweet Release and Run Away,worst single choices ever!! Like I Do and Lighthouse would of had that album top 20 for 3-4 months. Even my casual live fan friends who bought the album were dismayed they weren't released.

As for SFBM,Dan is right here again I think. If they wanted to go a rock single,which they won't,you'd go Show,thats the only one on there that might do ok.The rest would get dismissed immediatly.

It's an interesting time for the band.They are so fucking good on stage at the moment,but they seem to be missing the edge in the studio. I am stealing Eamon's thunder here,but Jim Wirt has to go! Mystery was murdered in the studio.Every other version of that song is so fucking good,except the studio version is almost bad. I have never seen a song at such different quality levels from performed live,to the studio recording. Hearing it in concert I'd almost say it's one of there best songs ever,but on the album,I almost skip it. The final production just seems to be watering down the songs,taking the edge off them,they have lost there character.I like most of the songs,but they all don't have to be so clean. I don't know the answer.....get angry again!

[NectarDan]

If Live spent more time in the studio working on their (new) material, I'm convinced that they could blow us all away again. I remember hearing that they recorded Like I Do in Nashville all by itself, putting alot of time and thought into it - and it definately shows. Just think how good all the other (new) songs could be if they crafted them with so much care as they did with Like I Do.

[Wambangalang]

they should just release show or night of nights to the rock format and see how it goes. If it flops, then its the same fate as the river and mystery suffered, and the same as if they would release another poppy song to the pop format so they have nothing to loose really, but could gain something.

and jim writ needs to be taken in sheets to the river flanked by love.

deep enough to dive.

[sandkind]

should, could, can, will, will not....doesn't matter, dan is right on Epic is done w/SFBM. i'd venture so far as to say they are done w/live.

good point earlier, they are at the top of their game in concert right now, what a fuckin' paradox.

[Whiskey]

should, could, can, will, will not....doesn't matter, dan is right on Epic is done w/SFBM. i'd venture so far as to say they are done w/live.

good point earlier, they are at the top of their game in concert right now, what a fuckin' paradox.

Which is why they need to fight to stay relevant. There's got to be someone in the industry left who recognizes their relevance??? The fact that - as musicians and live performers - there are few people who rival them???