Album Analysis, Throwing Copper Options

[Hoodstock]

Since Live is wrapping up and the board members are attacking each other, I thought it would be a good idea to provide a place to discuss Live's work. And a good place to start with their work is Throwing Copper.

The Idea - Analyze the album (in this case Throwing Copper) song by song, stating whatever you want or whatever comes to mind about each song. Go into as much or as little detail as you want and then summarize your overall thoughts on the album at the end. Just speak your mind openly. If there is a lot of feedback, we can do it again with another album at a later time.

You can copy and paste the following to make it easy if you want:

1. The Dam At Otter Creek

2. Selling The Drama

3. I Alone

4. Iris

5. Lightning Crashes

6. Top

7. All Over You

8. Shit Towne

9. T.B.D.

10. Stage

11. Waitress

12. Pillar of Davidson

13. White, Discussion

14. Hidden Track (Horse)

Overall Summary:

[Hoodstock]

1. The Dam At Otter Creek - Great energy build up at the end and a solid start to the album.

2. Selling The Drama - In my opinion, the best song on the entire album. This is the song that got me into Live. Can't say enough about it. Still my favorite today.

3. I Alone - Fit well on the album. Perhaps the most overrated song they have.

4. Iris - Solid song but not one of my favorites. Still not exactly sure what it is about

5. Lightning Crashes - Awesome song that put Live on the map. Great at it's time. I prefer the radio edited version today.

6. Top - Really enjoyed this song when I first heard it but lost interest over the years.

7. All Over You - Awesome song that is still great dispite the overplay. I never understood why they didn't lead with this as a major single. It was definately under utilized.

8. Shit Towne - One of my favorites off of this album. Hearing it in concert is always a treat. Along with Waitress it was a unique highlight of this album.

9. T.B.D. - Never really cared for this song. Good base line but hard to get into.

10. Stage - Great little song when the album came out. Not one I listen to today.

11. Waitress - Sweet song. The rise and drop bass line during the jam is perhaps the best bass moment Live has ever had. "She was a bitch" and "Some fucking change" are great lines. The whistling is also one of Live's great moments.

12. Pillar of Davidson - This song is disappointing. It had such great potential to be a hit but the first two versus drag out. That fact alone ruined it and kept it off the radio. They should have made a radio edit version!

13. White, Discussion - One of Live's best songs live. The album version drags on at the end but this song rocked on MTV Unplugged and was the highlight of the show. That version is one of my top Live favorites.

14. Hidden Track (Horse) - Wasn't expecting an extra track at the end. It stood out because it was so different, providing what I thought to be an awesome ending because it was such a curve.

Overall Summary: This was a great album for it's time and remains Live's best work to date in my opinion. The songs were mostly solid and the track order went well. There seems to have been a lot of thought behind it. In my opinion, one of the best complete albums of all time.

[Badman]

1. The Dam At Otter Creek

Perfect beginning track. I have never heard an album with a better intro that fit with the whole album. A second to this would be Korn's new album intro.

2. Selling The Drama

Hotly debated song that sounds great acoustic or whatever! I can tell he really spent time and crafted the poetry of this song.

3. I Alone

It's good... I dunno how it is radio good but okay. "Leave you there by yourself chained to fate" was such a good line. It was one of the preachier songs but I love the preachy, religion preachy only though...

4. Iris

Never understood the Knuckles part. Oddly sandwiched between two better songs.

5. Lightning Crashes

This song is one of the best I have ever heard. The clashes between soft and hard and the buildup to an emotional end make for an awesome studio song... not live... it gets lost when done live

6. Top

This coulda been a radio hit! I bet the bit about hitler is what held it down.

7. All Over You

Great opener for a show! It has Ed's weird voice that I don't know the name for but love. This song is really confusing though. What is it talking about?

8. Shit Towne

I think it is a little tasteless. Did they have to use the word "shit'? good at the end

9. T.B.D.

OMG bass. this song is so very good but you have to have a lyric sheet to understand it. It is lost on casual fans.

10. Stage

This song is one of those songs that gets better with time. It is superficial with the lyrics but It with lines like, "words are too feeble, they cannot contain" that it redeems itself. Also, Ed has never used the F bomb more effectively.

11. Waitress

Another Shit towne in my opinion. I Don't like the "she was a bitch" line. The Ed I know doesn't disrespect women.

12. Pillar of Davidson

I don't see why everyone downs this song. It is up there with LC in my opinion. It is also one of the easier live songs to sing when you are alone. Have you ever tried to sing "Mirror Song"? Also, The background singing at the end is awesome.

13. White, Discussion

I don't like the message in this song. It actually goes against my beliefs and I can't shift the song's meaning to be anything else. It basically confirms the Rapture in my eyes.


14. Hidden Track (Horse)

Move Susquehanna to song number 13. the Susquehanna from the acoustic sessions is the better one... not the demo version.

OVERALL OPINION:

We shoulda started with an album where all the songs weren't good. Let's do MJ or DOAD!

[stud]

12. Pillar of Davidson
This is easily the best song Live has ever recorded!

[Wambangalang]

1. The Dam At Otter Creek

ooh, we're in for a hell of a ride

2. Selling The Drama

okay, two in a row, surely it cant maintain

3. I Alone

where the shit did that come from? Freakin awesome. I love how the bible thumpers take this song and interpret it to mean something its not. Kinda like the bible.

4. Iris

goosebumps. One of the best songs ive ever heard.

5. Lightning Crashes

sadly, the most "overplayed" Live song is the most neglected by Live fans. Theres a reason it propelled TC to sell as many copies as it did: simply the best song ever created.

6. Top

Lyrically gold. Dont like to listen to it though. (edit) i think this song is also the focal point of much of what TC is about. This is especially evident in the album artwork.

7. All Over You

as far as pop-rock goes, it doesnt get any better than this folks. A song that is about absolutely nothing, but has the ability to throw you around the room like nothing else.

8. Shit Towne

Dont know why the douchbag before was offended by the word "shit", but i live there so i can relate. Just rocks.

9. T.B.D.

Inspired and passionate. Quite the turning point in the album in tone

10. Stage

shoulda coulda been a single. again, live at their best

11. Waitress

Starts off weird but is a great little tune that doesnt take itself too seriously. A characteristic that will be extinct on latter live albums

12. Pillar of Davidson

ahh the working mans song. Really a strange tune but is incapable of boring me.

13. White, Discussion

Only started to like this song last week. Was always too loud and un-melodic for my liking, but my tastes have changed and now this is one of my favs. This is the song i will now give to friends who listen to the new shit and say "Live is stoopid"

14. Hidden Track (Horse)

meh

Overall Summary:

its so sad that we will never have such an inspired, raw and creative album from these guys again. But....we will always have TC. No other fan can say that about their band.

This post has been edited by Wambangalang: Oct 15 2007, 11:39 pm

[torcatofan]

1. The Dam At Otter Creek
Great

2. Selling The Drama
Good

3. I Alone
Great

4. Iris
Great

5. Lightning Crashes
Great

6. Top
Ok

7. All Over You
Ok

8. Shit Towne
Good

9. T.B.D.
Good

10. Stage
Ok

11. Waitress
I've always wondered why this song is nothing like any other Live song.

12. Pillar of Davidson
Good

13. White, Discussion
Great

14. Hidden Track (Horse)
Good

Overall Summary:
Good


Let's do Secret Samadhi next.

[Badman]

douchbag before was offended by the word "shit"

Was the word Douchebag really necessary? And from an Aussie too... Oh well, I forgive you, Aussies can do little wrong

[Wambangalang]

is anything necessary?

[aLIVEinNORWAY]

1. The Dam At Otter Creek
I know you gonna think I'm a jerk when I say this: When I got TC from a friend he told me that this was a great cd, but I have to skip the first song...and I still do it 9 out of 10 times, so this is one of the Live songs I have heard the least.....sorry

2. Selling The Drama
My first meeting with Live. The second I heard this song I was saying to my friend: wow who is this. When I play Live for my friends, this is the song they have heard. Still a fave.

3. I Alone
Oh no we took it back to far, don't know how many times I have sang those words .Even my daugther at 9 knows them. A classic at concerts. And one of my top 5 Live songs.

4. Iris
Great song

5. Lightning Crashes
What can man said. Dont care if this has been `overplayed` a billion times, this is so great. Specially the begining with only the guitar and Ed.


6. Top
Great song

7. All Over You
Another killer. Like Badman said, a great opener. Norway went when they played it at the last tour.

8. Shit Towne
Not one of my biggest fave, but I have learned to live with it. It's good.

9. T.B.D.
A strange little song. But I like it.

10. Stage
Would have loved to hear this one played live.

11. Waitress
Ohhh.... this is one of my all time top 5 Live songs. Dont know if it's the lyric, the Roger Withaker whisthling or the mayhem guitars before the wisthling that does it. A shame that they don't played it live any more.

12. Pillar of Davidson
I think this is a verry underated Live song. Maybe it's slow in the begining, but that makes the end so mutch better. What a great chorus when Ed `finnaly` comes to it. And like Badman said; the background sinnging at the end makes a great song even greater.

13. White, Discussion
A great song. But I'm not one of them that have WD on my top 5, not even my top 10.

14. Hidden Track (Horse)
Is their any thing to say. I just

Overall Summary:
What a album. Not a bad song. Some betther than others.A album I still playe at least a coupple of times a month. When I first got it I thought Selling the Drama was so great. I played the album over and over again, but didn't get it. But I was thinking could they make a great song like Selling the Drama, they had to be good. And after some months I just said: wow heres another great song, and heres another one,and one more. And after that I have been around.

[Gunner Scott]

1. The Dam At Otter Creek

A great start to an album

2. Selling The Drama

Masterfully crafted song

3. I Alone

Great song despite the radio/VH1 overkill

4. Iris

I like the way my head beats to this song - in the prescence of my knuckles

5. Lightning Crashes

Great for the first 5 years, but its on the shelf now. I bring it out every 6 months or so to remind me of how perfect Live can be

6. Top

One of my fave tracks of the album

7. All Over You

Great for the first few years but still good when you don't hear it for a while

8. Shit Towne

Love this song. Every place in the world has a Shit Towne

9. T.B.D.

Intense

10. Stage

Without doubt the best song to play in your car at full volume

11. Waitress

This was fantastic until the whistling!! The whistling takes me back to the days of Roxette ("Joyride"). It spoilt what could have been one of their best songs on this album

12. Pillar of Davidson

Another superb but very intense song

13. White, Discussion

See Stage

14. Hidden Track (Horse)

She rode a horse into my head?? Who cares? I'm already drunk with enjoyment from this album so it doesnt matter!

Overall Summary:

This album is one of my top 3 albums of all time, I have even added Susquehanna and Lift Me Up as bonus tracks to make it even more superlative

[AgentK7]

You can't forget how much the artwork and album title went into making this a "must own" back in the mid 90's.

To me, the artwork is easily the best of Live's album covers. Sure "The Distance To Here" had some interesting abstract art, but this cover gave the album a little more depth. Did it mean anything in relation to the songs? Whose the guy, who are the others? What is this church? Are they going to fall over the cliff?

Throwing Copper was a cryptic title that probably made the album more interesting for people to check it out. I'd also say it was the best album title, not quite as "over the top" as "Mental Jewelry" which would be second.

[Hoodstock]

Throwing Copper was a cryptic title that probably made the album more interesting for people to check it out. I'd also say it was the best album title, not quite as "over the top" as "Mental Jewelry" which would be second.

Throwing Copper came from a reference when Pat and Chad G were messing around with pellet guns.

[DesertWater]

I'm not going to analyze each song because every song on this cd has been my #1 favorite at one point since its release. That's how awesome it is. Well, not Horse, which is same old. Right now, I love listening to White Discussion, TBD, and Top.

[Hoodstock]

I'm not going to analyze each song because every song on this cd has been my #1 favorite at one point since its release. That's how awesome it is. Well, not Horse, which is same old. Right now, I love listening to White Discussion, TBD, and Top.

Agreed, to this day it is still an awesome cd!

is anything necessary?

You could hold your breath and find out

This post has been edited by Hoodstock: Oct 17 2007, 7:05 pm

[AgentK7]

Throwing Copper came from a reference when Pat and Chad G were messing around with pellet guns.

Right, it was a personal in-joke that the typical listener didn't know about yet it was still an appealingly cryptic title.