I talked to a music industry professional recently, and he introduced me to the concept of a fly-out band.

Basically, there are two ways bands make money doing concerts. One way is to do all the legwork that comes with doing a tour. This involves costs, effort, and risk. Your money is tied to the revenue you generate doing the show (ticket sales, alcohol sales, merch, etc). While there might not be a lot of money in any one particular show, the hope is that over 60 dates you've made enough profit that the tour was worth it.

The other way to make money is to do fly-outs. Festivals and casino shows fall into this category. With a fly-out, the promoter/venue pays you a flat fee and covers all your costs in doing the show. There's no risk, you make guaranteed money, and it's comfortable.

It seems that with Live's reunion, they decided that they wanted to be comfortable and make guaranteed money. This explains almost every show they've done since coming back. The festivals and casinos are definite fly-outs. The Counting Crows tour might be somewhere in the middle, but I'm sure there was a lot less legwork and more guaranteed money doing that tour than headlining their own. The overseas show were big enough venues that there was probably little risk as well.

I think there are two ways to look at this. One is to say Live only cares about the money. The other is to say Live is made up of middle aged men who have other priorities. They can do shows here and there, make money, have fun, be comfortable, and get back to their lives.

I don't blame them for not wanting to do a traditional tour. I get that doing fly-outs is a nice lifestyle. It must be much better for Ed than doing his I Alone acoustic tour where he was driving himself to 200 person venues. It must be better for CCP who couldn't fill venues with Chris, and probably made very little on Summerland. It's their life, and this seems like a nice life.

I do wish though that they'd mix the setlists up and throw in some small venue shows here and there. They can do more to give the diehards what they want. It doesn't need to be a headlining tour, just enough that we can see them play 20 songs to their loyal fanbase.

Interesting. I also learned a lot about tours from tweets today by Eddie Trunk. I’ll italicize what Eddie Trunk said and bold fan comments:

Shows are booked by the bands booking agent. The dates / offers are then presented to the bands manager. He then discusses the offers with the band. Routing comes into play as well. Tour managers & tour staff only deal with day to day of the tour. Not booking

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Johnny McCarthy
@JohnnieVolume
Replying to @EddieTrunk
Band members on the national/international level have very little input on tour itineraries. This is the job of tour managers working in conjunction with transportation captains venue promoters. and the supporting bands people.


That factors in also. If there is a great promo support platform in the market that can drive tickets/people. For instance a country act may not play a market if no country station / fan base for that music

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TheeCleveland
@TheeCleveland
Replying to @EddieTrunk
Columbus ?! Pssssh, try Cleveland... the Home Of Rock N Roll ... literally no yours come through here but it doesn’t help the local terrestrial FM Rock station (WMMS) has been awful for YEARS

A big band playing a way small place is known as an “underplay” in the business. It’s done for promotion & buzz if a free show and pald for by sponsor. Or paid for by you with extreme ticket prices if a ticketed show.

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Keith Albertie
@kalbertie
Replying to @EddieTrunk
Agree, it's all about the promoters.
But...it's nice when a well known band plays a small venue...not necessarily for the money, but for the fans...i.e. less 1,000 seats or less. Garage Days.

It’s simple business. Some fans think an artist has some bias against playing their city. Almost never the case. It’s a business. The only criteria is how much do they want & does the promoter think it’s worth it and they will draw enough to make money

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Jimbo Martin
@jimbomartin729
Replying to @Afterbu00193682 @reddragoncartel and 15 others
Same thing for Memphis TN. We get the @foofighters and #Tool when they tour. Anyone else I want to see, I have to travel to Nashville.

Bands don’t pick or care what cities they play. The only criteria is if there is a promoter willing to book them & pay their guarantee. As simple as that. If you aren’t getting bands/shows it’s because promoters there don’t think they can make money with it.

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Afterburner
@Afterbu00193682
Replying to @reddragoncartel @HalSparks and 14 others
Thats great but would someone for a change answer my question, why are most (90%) bands avoiding Columbus ,Ohio, formerly a good rock town but not now, this is a real fucking problem

Live was once a great and is now a pathetic joke of a band. FIFY.

Great contribution to the thread.
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Ontopic: I'm not surprised. They haven't had a big hit since Overcome. They'd pretty much disappeared from the scene since 2006 and the 'big' breakup didn't really help their reputation either.
They pretty much have to start from scratch and with a mediocre effort that is their latest EP, i don't see them ever coming back from that. They now are on the level of a nostalgia band that have gigs here and there where they are wanted, other than that forget it. I will attend their Paradiso show though, just to bring people with me that never had seen them live. I think it probably will be the last time...

It's funny how a band like Muse, which started as a support for some shows in 1999, went stratospheric with huge albums and singles and sold out shows still going strong...and Live...well...

I got into Muse around the same time i really got into Live, so i have seen them move into really different career trajectories, which of course is something rather strange to witness.

This post has been edited by Lakini's Juice: Feb 8 2019, 12:20 pm

are the Jun 30-July 7 Euro dates all headlining shows?

Sounds like Post-reunion Live definitely qualifies for this term.

It looks like Live is sort of doing what I asked for in Europe. My guess is the Concert at Sea Festival 2019 in Brouwersdam, Netherlands on 28 June 2019 is paying for them to come to Europe. Then while they're out there, they're doing a few headlining shows in Europe for a week before flying back. My hope is they do more of these ~7 city mini tours around the festival dates. If they do that in the US I'd be thrilled.

That's true in your country, but Heaven charted elsewhere

We said the same thing but I said it succinctly and you droned on about Muse.

Haha " droned"...was that a pun? Because then it's funny.
It just was a general "musing", wouldn't call it droning on...because it had a point...unlike your post.

The Paradiso show already sold out.

This post has been edited by Lakini's Juice: Feb 9 2019, 8:01 am

I checked and Overcome was their biggest hit ever in The Netherlands.
But Heaven did chart here, but it didn't do as well.


The River 19 2006
We Deal In Dreams 21 2004
Run Away 22 2003
Heaven 21 2003
Overcome 2 2001
Simple Creed 8 2001
They Stood Up For Love 19 2000
Run To The Water 25 2000
The Dolphin's Cry 13 1999
Selling The Drama 15 1995
I Alone 22 1995

Secret Samadhi singles didn't chart.

lightning crashes didn't chart?

Nope.

Live flew literally half way around the world (Brisbane, Australia) to play 1 show. Even though they had toured (3 shows) the country earlier in the year.

They are desperate for money and are doing whatever it takes to stay afloat. No wonder CT and PD are sporting the panhandler look and CG ruptured his triceps tendon.